The Consequences of Brexit (part 2)

[apelike]

The pounds has NEVER been this low against the dollar before.

 

Yes it HAS as in 1985 it was worth only $1.09 $1.05

Edited January 10, 2017 by apelike

[Jacktari]

Yes it has as in 1985 it was worth only $1.09 $1.05

 

The divine Margaret was in power. Another anti-European.

[Cyclone]

Oh hello. Another member of the remainers' "you don't agree with me so you're stupid" club.

Allow me my standard introduction: You lost. Deal with it.

 

Do you not accept that as levels of education increased people were more likely to vote remain?

Or is it just that it makes you uncomfortable because you were an exception?

 

---------- Post added 10-01-2017 at 21:47 ----------

 

Yes it HAS as in 1985 it was worth only $1.09 $1.05

 

Well I stand corrected. And I'm also amazed that you are living in 1988. You claimed it was 2 or 3 years ago. Perhaps you meant 23 years ago? But it was actually 32 years ago, and very briefly.

 

http://fxtop.com/en/historical-exchange-rates.php?YA=1&C1=GBP&C2=USD&A=1&YYYY1=1953&MM1=01&DD1=01&YYYY2=2017&MM2=01&DD2=10&LANG=en

 

Interestingly, that previous low was actually a $ high against all currencies. So high that the US government devalued the $ to get it under control.

This time the $ is stable, it's the £ that is weak. So weak that it's at the weakest in 32 years. Not 2 or 3 years like you claimed.

[apelike]

Do you not accept that as levels of education increased people were more likely to vote remain?

Or is it just that it makes you uncomfortable because you were an exception?

 

I cant speak for unbeliever but I know I don't accept that argument. Maybe you can provide some further details as to how it works?

 

---------- Post added 10-01-2017 at 21:54 ----------

 

Well I stand corrected. And I'm also amazed that you are living in 1988. You claimed it was 2 or 3 years ago. Perhaps you meant 23 years ago? But it was actually 32 years ago, and very briefly.

 

Can you point out where and which post I claimed it was 2 or 3 years ago as in my post of 2142, which I said $1.09 and corrected later I stated categorically that it was 1985. It also does not matter how briefly as I was correcting you initial error or stating NEVER.

 

Maybe my levels of education and reading skills are better.

Edited January 10, 2017 by apelike

[Cyclone]

You can search for the demographic breakdown of voters I'm sure.

 

The older you were the more likely to vote leave.

The more educated you were the more likely to vote stay.

 

There are quite a few other ways of splitting it as well.

 

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2016/06/how-did-different-demographic-groups-vote-eu-referendum

 

The decision for the UK to leave the European Union was overwhelmingly supported in parts of England with low income and education levels.

https://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2016/jun/24/the-areas-and-demographics-where-the-brexit-vote-was-won

 

Interestingly enough, some calculations based on death rates and time passing have shown that if we redid the vote now and the same patterns remained, we'd vote remain. That's how many of the elderly have died and the young have become >18 since the vote was taken.

 

---------- Post added 10-01-2017 at 22:22 ----------

 

Apologies, it was gomgec that made that claim, not you.

Edited January 10, 2017 by Cyclone

[El Cid]

Do you not accept that as levels of education increased people were more likely to vote remain?

Or is it just that it makes you uncomfortable because you were an exception?

 

I accept that, but I believe the educated are more likely to be wealthy. The wealthy are more likely to be taking international holidays, and see more diversity, and less poverty and lack of housing.

 

I was talking to a fellow worker today, she was telling me about the stolen goods that she was buying from a friend. I dont even know anyone selling stolen goods, we mix with folk similar to ourselves.

 

Are leave voters more likely to know someone that cannot get social housing?

[Cyclone]

I accept that, but I believe the educated are more likely to be wealthy. The wealthy are more likely to be taking international holidays, and see more diversity, and less poverty and lack of housing.

 

I was talking to a fellow worker today, she was telling me about the stolen goods that she was buying from a friend. I dont even know anyone selling stolen goods, we mix with folk similar to ourselves.

 

Are leave voters more likely to know someone that cannot get social housing?

 

It's entirely possible that you're correct. Higher annual income was also correlated with voting remain.

 

Scotland proved the exception to this trend: people there voted to remain in the European Union regardless of their education and income. For example, just 17% hold a higher education qualification in North Lanarkshire but the voters there came out strongly for remain.

Not sure why this is though.

 

I suspect that the less educated and less well off were voting against the government, rather than voting for something (in many cases, not all).

Or perhaps they just want change. They don't care what the change is, and don't do anything to find out, but they feel somehow that 'change' will help them.

Or perhaps they need someone to blame for their situation, so they blame the EU, immigrants, the government, all convenient targets and so they vote to leave the EU which will magically cut immigration and fix the problems they face...

 

It's not guardian spin either, the same demographic breakdown reported in the telegraph.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/24/eu-referendum-how-the-results-compare-to-the-uks-educated-old-an/

 

The Brexit vote overlapped strongly with the UK's older population

 

Those aged over 60 were the most likely group to want to leave the EU, according the polls before the vote.

The elderly have sold the youngest down the river, despite the elderly basically being unaffected by the EU anyway...

 

Class was a key dividing line in the EU referendum

 

Levels of education and class overlap strongly in the UK, and so the Brexit vote also matched up with areas with higher levels of people from the DE social class - meaning people in semi-skilled or unskilled labour, those in casual labour and pensioners.

 

Why am I even having to prove this. This is all well established, how can anyone who wants to talk about this topic not know this?

Edited January 10, 2017 by Cyclone

[retep]

No but the EU is not going to fall apart, but that has nothing to do with Brexit.

 

You decide to leave, than leave, it's your choice.

 

I think you will find that when article 50 is triggerred the cloves come off.

They have published the names of the main negotiators and one name stands out Guy Verhofstead, the man Farage insulted all the time. I think there will be some pay back.

 

Looks like your Guy is getting it,

 

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/752166/Brexit-negotiator-Guy-Verhofstadt-presidency-dream-dies

[apelike]

Interestingly enough, some calculations based on death rates and time passing have shown that if we redid the vote now and the same patterns remained, we'd vote remain. That's how many of the elderly have died and the young have become >18 since the vote was taken.

 

I very much doubt that, according to the telegraph "there will still be well over 600,000 people turning 65 each year until at least 2018 and overall 3.3 million people are poised to hit state pension age in the next five years." Admittedly that was from 2013 and I somehow doubt that elderly deaths since the referendum are greater than any increase in pensioners. Calculating the >18 is also a bit of a straw man as if those who were eligible to vote had voted then the vote could have swung the other way. Stating things in hindsight is not really a positive argument.

Edited January 10, 2017 by apelike

[I1L2T3]

I very much doubt that, according to the telegraph "there will still be well over 600,000 people turning 65 each year until at least 2018 and overall 3.3 million people are poised to hit state pension age in the next five years." Admittedly that was from 2013 and I somehow doubt that elderly deaths since the referendum are greater than any increase in pensioners. Calculating the >18 is also a bit of a straw man as if those who were eligible to vote had voted then the vote could have swung the other way. Stating things in hindsight is not really a positive argument.

 

If you know many younger people you'd realise the result has alerted them to politics. I have several kids above and below the 18 year old minimum for voting, and no word of a lie of their friends I can count on the fingers of one hand those who wouldn't vote (if they could) if the vote was held again, and on the fingers of the other the number who would vote leave. I'm talking about their extended friendship groups, maybe 70 kids or even more. Kids are very awake to this issue and a lot of them are feeling pretty angry.

 

This is of course the sort of thing Brexiters are terrified of, and why they want to railroad things through. You have to take a step back and think about what things would be like if we don't deliver a Brexit that suits as many people as possible.