banjodeano Posted October 31, 2016 Author Share Posted October 31, 2016 Why - he's been acquitted? As I recall compensation paid out as well. Yet the miners feeling a bit sore after losing whine for 32 years. Meanwhile everyone else gets on with their lives. Why do the miners whine so much -do tell.. you really dont get it do you,? its nothing to do with the miners, forget the mines, forget the riots, forget the politics of the day....its about the fabric of our society, what you are saying its okay for police to lie and tell untruths when it suits, that can never be right, you cant have a police force that decides on each individual case whether they will be honest or not, because one day it may come to your door, i thought you were better than that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikem8634 Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 Who though? All the people involved are long since retired and anyone there now is well aware of how bent the force was back then. That would be for the inquiry to discover wouldn't it? The point is, as it was with Hillsborough, you can't know until you look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geared Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 I know. The question was why do miner's continue to whine. Because a lot of them lost their jobs and don't think it was fair. I think anyone who looses their job would think it's quite unfair. Many miners retrained and went onto work in the steel industry and I doubt you'd be able to find one single ex-miner who would happily go down one of those pits today! ---------- Post added 31-10-2016 at 17:30 ---------- That would be for the inquiry to discover wouldn't it? The point is, as it was with Hillsborough, you can't know until you look. but we do know? The public are more than aware the police weren't the white knights they claimed to be. SYP has a terrible reputation for historical corruption and mis-deeds. I don't understand what you think is going to come out of any inquiry?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikem8634 Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 you really dont get it do you,? its nothing to do with the miners, forget the mines, forget the riots, forget the politics of the day....its about the fabric of our society, what you are saying its okay for police to lie and tell untruths when it suits, that can never be right, you cant have a police force that decides on each individual case whether they will be honest or not, because one day it may come to your door, i thought you were better than that Bingo. It is about the incredibly low standards people are prepared to apply to their institutions so long as those lows are are scraped in the service of something they agree with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santo Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 I think anyone who looses their job would think it's quite unfair. Many miners retrained and went onto work in the steel industry and I doubt you'd be able to find one single ex-miner who would happily go down one of those pits today! Perhaps. Obelix asked why miners still whine. So one can assume he thinks they still whine. Asked and possible answer given (Not sure now if he meant just those at Orgreave but thinking about it, most probably) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geared Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 Bingo. It is about the incredibly low standards people are prepared to apply to their institutions so long as those lows are are scraped in the service of something they agree with. It's far more important to know that the police force we have now is nothing like it was back then. You can't change what happened back then, you can't change the corruption and lies back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geared Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 Perhaps. Obelix asked why miners still whine. So one can assume he thinks they still whine. Asked and possible answer given (Not sure now if he meant just those at Orgreave but thinking about it, most probably) Someone still whines, but I'm not sure they're miners to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikem8634 Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 (edited) The public are more than aware the police weren't the white knights they claimed to be. SYP has a terrible reputation for historical corruption and mis-deeds. I don't understand what you think is going to come out of any inquiry?? Perhaps it tells us more about SYP. Perhaps it goes beyond SYP. Perhaps it tells us more about the miners or the unions. Perhaps it uncovers crime that can be prosecuted. Perhaps it saves a highly marginalised group from having to defend themselves for the rest of their lives. Perhaps it rewrites history. Perhaps it doesn't. Orgreave and Hillsborough are not the same. Accountability for one does not equal accountability for the other. None of this can be known until an open inquiry takes place. ---------- Post added 31-10-2016 at 17:40 ---------- It's far more important to know that the police force we have now is nothing like it was back then. You can't change what happened back then, you can't change the corruption and lies back then. Again, the same things were said about Hillsborough and look what we discovered there. Did you ever say similarly dismissive things about that? I have no desire to change the past, why would you think I wanted to enact the impossible. You are concerned with knowing 'that the police force we have now is nothing like it was back then'. Were it not for inquiries you would have little idea how it was back then. In fact, they were still trying to defend how it was back then at the end of the new Inquests. An inquiry into Orgreave could bring more pressure to radically depart from how it was back then. Edited October 31, 2016 by mikem8634 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 (edited) Perhaps it tells us more about SYP. Perhaps it goes beyond SYP. Perhaps it tells us more about the miners or the unions. Perhaps it uncovers crime that can be prosecuted. Perhaps it saves a highly marginalised group from having to defend themselves for the rest of their lives. Perhaps it rewrites history. Perhaps it doesn't. Orgreave and Hillsborough are not the same. Accountability for one does not equal accountability for the other. None of this can be known until an open inquiry takes place. ---------- Post added 31-10-2016 at 17:40 ---------- Again, the same things were said about Hillsborough and look what we discovered there. Did you ever say similarly dismissive things about that? I have no desire to change the past, why would you think I wanted to enact the impossible. They are very similar - same police force, roughly the same time, same government in charge. Only nobody died - that is crucial. Hillsborough enquiry cost £70m according to a quick google. Wouldn't you rather have that money protecting your community now? But let's say there's a U turn. What else needs digging up? 32 years is clearly not too late so how far back do you want to go? ---------- Post added 31-10-2016 at 17:50 ---------- Edited October 31, 2016 by medusa removed quote from deleted post- apologies for tinkering with your post, but it was that or delete all of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banjodeano Posted October 31, 2016 Author Share Posted October 31, 2016 They are very similar - same police force, roughly the same time, same government in charge. Only nobody died - that is crucial. Hillsborough enquiry cost £70m according to a quick google. Wouldn't you rather have that money protecting your community now? But let's say there's a U turn. What else needs digging up? 32 years is clearly not too late so how far back do you want to go? ---------- Post added 31-10-2016 at 17:50 ---------- Do you think the police is run in the same way now as it was then? To be honest i have no idea, i would like to think not, but back in the Hilsborough and miners days, i would have also said not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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