999tigger Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 The best deal according to the Tories, or Parliament? The best deal according to what the government can manage. That is why they are the government. Fortunately I see a few people recognising that beyond leaving the EU, then no terms were negtoated or made clear as to what this meant. A lot of those voting to leave had different ideas what this might entail, other than not being a member. Brexit means brexit means merely that we leave, but not the terms or of our future engagement with the EU. There is nothing wrong with MPs voting against leaving. Its unlikely as a whole they will defy the will of the people in referendum. If the feeling is that strong they would just lose in general election. ---------- Post added 12-11-2016 at 10:38 ---------- The population of our country. They dont get to decide. That is for the government and then (now it seems) parliament to ratify. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harvey19 Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 The best deal according to what the government can manage. That is why they are the government. Fortunately I see a few people recognising that beyond leaving the EU, then no terms were negtoated or made clear as to what this meant. A lot of those voting to leave had different ideas what this might entail, other than not being a member. Brexit means brexit means merely that we leave, but not the terms or of our future engagement with the EU. There is nothing wrong with MPs voting against leaving. Its unlikely as a whole they will defy the will of the people in referendum. If the feeling is that strong they would just lose in general election. ---------- Post added 12-11-2016 at 10:38 ---------- They dont get to decide. That is for the government and then (now it seems) parliament to ratify. The best deal for the population is the result I expect our chosen representatives and their advisors to get for us when negotiating new terms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Cid Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 The best deal according to what the government can manage. That is why they are the government. The Tories promised below 100,000 net immigration in 2010 and 2015, the electorate were not satisfied with this; should they try to get zero immigration? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mafya Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 Brexit will happen: 'Arrogant' Remoaners told nothing will derail article 50= http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/731456/Brexit-Article-50-Remoaners-Lib-Dems-referendum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamston Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 What does "Brexit" mean? "Article 50 would proceed but only if there is a referendum on the terms of the deal", then people would know what they voted for, they did not vote for the Tories version of "Brexit". The majority voted to leave the EU, which means we are leaving the EU. There will be no freedom of movement because there was no freedom of movement before we joined the EEC. Similarly, America voted for Donald Trump and he won the election by the rules. These means Donald Trump will be the next American President. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
999tigger Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 The best deal for the population is the result I expect our chosen representatives and their advisors to get for us when negotiating new terms. Ofc, but people may differ on their opinions when they consider whether it is the best or not. Some may wnat free movement, others may not care etc. Until we know what we want and are prepared to accept or what the EU want and are prepared to give us, then we simply do not know. It is a complete unknown and one on which the leave voters wont agree on, other than leave. ---------- Post added 12-11-2016 at 11:02 ---------- The Tories promised below 100,000 net immigration in 2010 and 2015, the electorate were not satisfied with this; should they try to get zero immigration? I believe they have shifted it away from specific tragets and made it more an issue of control. Its ok it is whatever it is as long as they have the power to say no. ---------- Post added 12-11-2016 at 11:06 ---------- The majority voted to leave the EU, which means we are leaving the EU. There will be no freedom of movement because there was no freedom of movement before we joined the EEC. Similarly, America voted for Donald Trump and he won the election by the rules. These means Donald Trump will be the next American President. That is silly thinking. The government have to deal with reality and decide what is best for the UK including how it wishes to interact with the EU and the single market. A lot of things didnt exist when we joined, but that doesnt mean we have to ignore them. The vote was simply to leave, but the terms and future re-engagement were left undecided. It would be stupid to not get the best deal for the UK possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melthebell Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 the original referendum shouldve asked what kind of brexit people wanted rather than a simple yes / no, then all this wouldnt be happening, theyd know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 Exactly. I don`t think any MPs are seeking to reverse "the will of the voters" (though there are many with deep misgivings about the Leave campaign and it was a close election......), they`re saying nobody actually knows what sort of "Brexit" the public voted for. The hardline Brexiteers are being the most undemocratic of all by arrogantly (and incorrectly) saying they know, and, by pure chance, it`s what they want. All the MPs are saying is the public should be given a chance to decide what type of Brexit there will be, or even if they still want it when it becomes clear what it actually means. How can that be "undemocratic". How can having a vote be "undemocratic", that`s a contradiction in terms. You're being rather silly. Obviously telling people to vote again because you didn't like the answer is undemocratic. Very little would be more so. So would it have been okay to have another referendum on the terms of remaining if we had voted to remain? If so then it could have been announced as a double-referendum in the first place. A second referendum before triggering article 50 is a do-over. Any assertion to the contrary is a rather obvious lie. A referendum at the end of the 2 year negotiation on the terms of exit is acceptable as long as it is understood that a no to that deal means a straight exit on WTO rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamston Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 the original referendum shouldve asked what kind of brexit people wanted rather than a simple yes / no, then all this wouldnt be happening, theyd know At the time everyone understood the question on the ballot paper. Sore losers are attempting to stop the democratic wishes of the people being carried out. The UK will leave the EU and the deluded sore losers will not stop the democratic wishes of the people being carried out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 At the time everyone understood the question on the ballot paper. Sore losers are attempting to stop the democratic wishes of the people being carried out. The UK will leave the EU and the deluded sore losers will not stop the democratic wishes of people being carried out. Absolutely. Both campaigns were absolutely crystal clear that exit meant full exit including the internal market and customs union. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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