The House Of Lords, The Unelected Elite.

[Santo]

You have no idea how the House of Lords work do you? The upper house can't ultimately scupper the wishes of Brexit if the Commons want it. There is legislation in place to bypass the Lords. I wish people do a bit of research. Geez.

 

I'm not totally clued up on the Parliament Acts. Do they have sufficient provisions to be usable in this instance?

[phil752]

Really?

 

Democracy how you want it under pain of sanction? Any other view is "wrong"?

 

The commons will vote how they damn well please I hope and if you don't like that tough.

 

the point of our democracy is that we can hold to account anyone, every five years, if you call that a sanction so be it.

 

---------- Post added 15-11-2016 at 19:03 ----------

 

So what sort of Brexit did their constituents vote for? How will they know which wishes they are ignoring? If we end up with a hard exit how do you know that that will please their electorate?Similarly if we get a soft exit.....it isn't black and white...

 

You have only to see on TV when a labour MP is questioned why they supported remain when the majority of their constituents voted leave, they avoid the question like mad.

Edited November 15, 2016 by phil752

[andyofborg]

I'm not totally clued up on the Parliament Acts. Do they have sufficient provisions to be usable in this instance?

 

Yes

 

Though i haven't seen any evidence that the lords would attempt to delay the process

 

Many of the lords take their role seriously and understand that they cannot and should not stand against the will of the elected house.

 

They might make a symbolic protest by returning the Bill to the Commons when it is first presented and when the Commons returns it 10 minutes later it will pass without a whimper, but I doubt they will do even that.

 

On the more general point of having an elected second chamber, then it would be a shame to lose some of the experts who have been put there on the basis of their contribution to science, technology etc.

 

The Commons demands it's supremacy on the basis that it is elected and the Lords isn't. An elected second chamber would result in a body which is just as elected as the Commons which undermines that argument and is pretty much why attempts at proper reform end up in the long grass.

 

To do it properly, a move to an elected second chamber should also be accompanied by a move to a proper constitution which defines the powers and boundaries of all parts of the government.

[BHRemovals]

I want saving from brexit. leave it as it ias

[Santo]

Yes

 

Though i haven't seen any evidence that the lords would attempt to delay the process

 

Many of the lords take their role seriously and understand that they cannot and should not stand against the will of the elected house.

 

They might make a symbolic protest by returning the Bill to the Commons when it is first presented and when the Commons returns it 10 minutes later it will pass without a whimper, but I doubt they will do even that.

 

On the more general point of having an elected second chamber, then it would be a shame to lose some of the experts who have been put there on the basis of their contribution to science, technology etc.

 

The Commons demands it's supremacy on the basis that it is elected and the Lords isn't. An elected second chamber would result in a body which is just as elected as the Commons which undermines that argument and is pretty much why attempts at proper reform end up in the long grass.

 

To do it properly, a move to an elected second chamber should also be accompanied by a move to a proper constitution which defines the powers and boundaries of all parts of the government.

 

Ok thanks. I don't expect MPs to vote against or the Lords to block it. Was just wondering, as a point of law, if the Parliament Acts were rigorous enough to be used here. It's a pretty major thing. As far as I know it was last used for something more 'trivial' (that is to say, not earth shattering) to do with hunting.

[andyofborg]

Ok thanks. I don't expect MPs to vote against or the Lords to block it. Was just wondering, as a point of law, if the Parliament Acts were rigorous enough to be used here. It's a pretty major thing. As far as I know it was last used for something more 'trivial' (that is to say, not earth shattering) to do with hunting.

 

pretty much all that's needed is for the Bill to start in the Commons and a certificate from the Speaker.

 

I imagine it would be hard to argue that an Article 50 Bill didn't meet the criteria for what the Parliament Acts call a Money Bill, so at most it can be delayed by a month. Other Bills can be delayed by up to a year though it's possible to arrange matters to shorten that period.

[ez8004]

The most expensive power station ever built, making the most expensive energy ever made. Plus the costs of decommissioning and long term storage of waste.

 

The govt has promised to buy power at 95p per megawatt (?) but the cost of on shore wind is already down to about 65p and would be lower if planners would allow larger turbines.

 

It's argued that nuclear can provide a "base load".

 

I reckon unbeliever would do a much better job at procuring nuclear than the govt who seem to be paying way too much for an unproven technology by those famous providers of quality products, China.

 

 

 

---------- Post added 15-11-2016 at 16:20 ----------

 

 

I think you'd review - and understand - what the scientists are telling us.

 

If you disagree then you won't just say "la la can't hear you", you'd submit a proper rebuttal that advances the debate.

 

I don't want a house full of scientists. There's room for lots of other experts in their field.

 

Why are people calling Hinckley C the most expensive station ever built? We are getting TWO for that price. It is the going rate for that class of civil reactor.

[unbeliever]

Why are people calling Hinckley C the most expensive station ever built? We are getting TWO for that price. It is the going rate for that class of civil reactor.

 

I think it's the guaranteed unit price which make it look expensive.

[Berberis]

If all the Parasites in the Lords claimed their meager £300 per day for 5 days a week, it amounts to around £1,250,000 per year. If their numbers were at least limited to around 100 it would reduce their cost to around £175,000. Remembering the vast majority of these spongers are LIFE Peers, who as the law is cannot be removed. Nice work if you can get it.

 

You are making little sense and zero logic.

 

First of all, attendance allowances are not connected to the Peers being unelected, so reducing their number does not effect their place or their being Unelected. Second, not all members received £300 a day, some receive £150.

 

Now on to your other rantings. Life Peerages, these are the shortest of the peerages, not the ones to make an example of. I think you are confused, Life peerages are given to those who have served the country and end with the persons death. Heredity peerages are the real "Unelected Elites" by virtue of them being handed down to their next of kin, however, its a misconception that all of those with these titles are somehow elites, and its the short sighted, socialist worker wielding, green eyed monster that gets easily confused. Hears of a title, thinks "Downtown Abbey" or "You Rang Me'Lord" and starts to go into a socialist rage.

 

Seriously, if you are going to get all hot under the collar, you could at least do some research.

[sgtkate]

You are making little sense and zero logic.

 

First of all, attendance allowances are not connected to the Peers being unelected, so reducing their number does not effect their place or their being Unelected. Second, not all members received £300 a day, some receive £150.

 

Now on to your other rantings. Life Peerages, these are the shortest of the peerages, not the ones to make an example of. I think you are confused, Life peerages are given to those who have served the country and end with the persons death. Heredity peerages are the real "Unelected Elites" by virtue of them being handed down to their next of kin, however, its a misconception that all of those with these titles are somehow elites, and its the short sighted, socialist worker wielding, green eyed monster that gets easily confused. Hears of a title, thinks "Downtown Abbey" or "You Rang Me'Lord" and starts to go into a socialist rage.

 

Seriously, if you are going to get all hot under the collar, you could at least do some research.

 

However, I do think hereditary peers should be phased out completely. Getting powers simply because of who your daddy was doesn't sit well with me. I don't like the lords much really, but I can accept having life peers who are nominated to the house for deeds they've done.