Respecting others' beliefs and customs, where do we draw the line?

[RootsBooster]

Prayer can bring the best out in people and work to uplift peoples spirits alongside medicine which is not the total answer!

 

Are you taking the ****?

[mossdog]

Are you taking the ****?

..........now why would you post a dumdown low intellect post like that???

[biotechpete]

Okay then, care to expand on what medical conditions you'd prefer to receive prayer as a treatment?

 

Well for a cough, the placebo effect of almost any intervention seems at least as good as any OTC remedy. Not really the point I grant you, but there are some conditions where 'positive thinking' is about the best hope you have.

[SnailyBoy]

.......but it is my point! Medicine and prayer/meditation can work alongside each other,they don't need to be polarized as you seem to indicate.

 

That's a strawman. I didn't say that at all in my original point around belief. There have been many cases where parents have ignored medical treatment in favour of their belief in prayer, to the detriment of the child.

Edited December 16, 2016 by SnailyBoy

[L00b]

This can apply to many things (not just religion), with regards to respecting the beliefs, customs, wishes and desires of others, where should we draw the line?

At the point where it begins to impinge your own circumstances.

 

"La liberté des uns s'arrête là où commence celle des autres"

 

(One's freedom ends where that of others begins: a quote which defines mutual and reciprocal respect in all circumstances, including one's beliefs, customs, wishes and desires and those of others).

 

Under that principle, people's right to believe should be respected, but no more (because asking a person to respect such beliefs as well, or instead, is impinging that person's belief system/values).

[RootsBooster]

..........now why would you post a dumdown low intellect post like that???

Because SnailyBoy was talking about using prayer instead of medicine, your response appeared to condone this.

I accept that anyone should be able to believe what they want.

 

However, I also accept that any belief should be subject to scrutiny.

 

For example, if someone believed that prayer would heal their sick child rather than relying on conventional medicine. I'd want the child to be protected from that belief.

Prayer can bring the best out in people and work to uplift peoples spirits alongside medicine which is not the total answer!

It's something that bothers me, children have died in the past because of it.

In fact, now the issue's been brought up, it's an excellent example of one (or two, with parents) person's beliefs affecting someone else (the child).

Should the parents' beliefs and wishes be respected when it means their child will likely die or suffer because of it?

 

Some real life cases;

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/apr/13/followers-of-christ-idaho-religious-sect-child-mortality-refusing-medical-help

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2507563/Faith-healing-parents-guilty-murder-2nd-child-dies-pneumonia.html

 

http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/parents-who-desperately-ill-baby-10423122

 

---------- Post added 16-12-2016 at 10:18 ----------

 

.......but it is my point! Medicine and prayer/meditation can work alongside each other,they don't need to be polarized as you seem to indicate.

 

If I was in a hospital bed with a serious illness and I heard someone praying for me it would likely annoy me and insult me. Quite possibly it would make me feel worse.

 

---------- Post added 16-12-2016 at 10:22 ----------

 

We should accept people beliefs; so long as they do not interfere with other peoples human rights.

 

But then some human rights seem to conflict

 

If someone believed they shouldn't have to work or provide for themselves and that the state should support them, you'd accept that?

[unbeliever]

Freedom of speech comes above protection from being offended.

I reserve the right to forcefully criticise the superstitious, especially theists, most especially Yahwists, and most especially of all conservative Yahwists (mostly found in Islam these days).

[Alcoblog]

As everyone has their own individual beliefs, be they based upon misinformation, hope, compassion, malice/general beligerance, the impossible, whatever, it's hardly possible for anyone to be judged by anyone else (who believe they're right to).

I'd say that everyone has a right to believe whatever they want (free thought) so long as it doesn't harm others … there again, that's just my belief.

 

Obviously, some believes are just plain stupid … flat Earth, Santa, hobgoblins etc, and are much derided by the majority of better informed individuals.

Where to draw the line though, and to who's rules? What delineates belief from philosophy, or are they the same/subsections of (Venn diagram stylie)?

 

Although I don't 'believe' in the religious sense, I have no problem with others who do. If it works for them and makes them happy in their brief flicker of existence on the planet, why not? It would be a futile task to attempt to change peoples thoughts to those of your own, as well as if you did, the world would become very boring indeed.

I draw the line though when religion (or any other radical thought) resorts to violence, this being a point I believe, where belief turns instead to mental illness. There again, is belief just a form of mental illness, harmless or otherwise? What is mental illness anyway? Where to draw the line of acceptance?

 

Basically, as we are not machines or pre-programmed computers, there will be conflict of thought. That's my belief.

[tinfoilhat]

As everyone has their own individual beliefs, be they based upon misinformation, hope, compassion, malice/general beligerance, the impossible, whatever, it's hardly possible for anyone to be judged by anyone else (who believe they're right to).

I'd say that everyone has a right to believe whatever they want (free thought) so long as it doesn't harm others … there again, that's just my belief.

 

Obviously, some believes are just plain stupid … flat Earth, Santa, hobgoblins etc, and are much derided by the majority of better informed individuals.

Where to draw the line though, and to who's rules? What delineates belief from philosophy, or are they the same/subsections of (Venn diagram stylie)?

 

Although I don't 'believe' in the religious sense, I have no problem with others who do. If it works for them and makes them happy in their brief flicker of existence on the planet, why not? It would be a futile task to attempt to change peoples thoughts to those of your own, as well as if you did, the world would become very boring indeed.

I draw the line though when religion (or any other radical thought) resorts to violence, this being a point I believe, where belief turns instead to mental illness. There again, is belief just a form of mental illness, harmless or otherwise? What is mental illness anyway? Where to draw the line of acceptance?

 

Basically, as we are not machines or pre-programmed computers, there will be conflict of thought. That's my belief.

 

If you ask the mod team nicely they might put that as an option on the poll:thumbsup:

[Obelix]

Here's a thought for you.

 

I'm on a hospital ward. The guy in the bed next to me is religious and has the chaplain visit him for comfort. Every day the chaplain prays for him and all other sick people to be healed.

 

I don't want pointless prayers. They make me feel uncomfortable. Do I have the right to insist the chaplain only prays for the individual in the bed?