silentP Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 It's a bereavement process, it'll take time to come to terms with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NigelFargate Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 The EU is not trying to create a federal Europe... Discuss. Juncker and Verhofstadt are trying to create a federal Europe. There is undoubtedly a strong federalist strain of thinking in continental Europe. It is not the only one, but it remains significant (despite setbacks, the federalists show no signs of giving up). ---------- Post added 04-05-2017 at 15:40 ---------- Didn't Churchill originate the same notion after the war, though he excluded Britain from the idea. He saw it as the only way to stop Europe warring with one another. Yes he did in his famous Zurich speech in 1946. However, we have no idea what Churchill's views on Europe would be if he were alive today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairyloon Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 Yes he did in his famous Zurich speech in 1946. However, we have no idea what Churchill's views on Europe would be if he were alive today. We can reasonably believe that his views on democracy (or "fake democracy" as UB put it) would remain much the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 The trouble is that most remainers are not happy with how the vote turned out and cannot accept that people voted differently to them. They and the media then deride them for being, racist, xenophobic and for having a low education. Some are racist and some are xenophobic, which can also be said of remain voters. Plenty especially the older generation may have a lower education but that does not mean that are less intelligent or incapable of making a decision as a lot of them also voted remain. Leave voters are of course entitled to think that as a country we are making a terrible mistake. Expect to go to your grave with your grandchildren knowing what you did, and never accepting or understanding it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairyloon Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 The trouble is that most remainers are not happy with how the vote turned out... Most reasonable people of both camps ought not be happy with how the vote was carried out. It epitomises the death of democracy in this country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Shaw Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 The EU is not trying to create a federal Europe. So why does it espouse ever-closer union, characteristic of a federation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Litotes Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 Theresa May is not stealing from us as long as her expenses are in line with her job and cost effective. As I say, if an assessment was done and using a helicopter was the best option then let her use a helicopter, but equally, if a train would have been just as safe and cheaper then she should use that. She should not be treated differently for campaigning because she's the PM because that would give a massively unfair advantage to any sitting PM who can call on greater resources, no matter who that PM may be. But Theresa May is still PM and how can she be doing her PMs job while at the same time campaigning for her own seat and her own party. She must be letting someone down - perhaps her constituents or perhaps her party or perhaps her country. Surely she should step down as PM if she claims to be equal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Shaw Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 But every PM has to be an MP (or Peer- not recently, though). So presumably you prefer the idea of a Peer as PM? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Litotes Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 But every PM has to be an MP (or Peer- not recently, though). So presumably you prefer the idea of a Peer as PM? Your presumption is a non-sequitur. Maybe we elect the MPs and they choose a PM who isn't an MP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Equato Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 It's a bereavement process, it'll take time to come to terms with it. Not always like that, one paragraph from the "BBC on this day" website for 06th June 1975, about the origanal in/out EEC referendum. --------------------------------------------------------------- Members of the "No" campaign accepted their defeat and promised to work constructively within the EEC. ---------------------------------------------------------------- I mean that can't be right can it, aren't the losers of a referendum supposed to stamp their feet, have mass protests, insult their opponents and demand an immediate second vote because people didn't know what they were voting for, suppose it must be a lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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