What's May up to? General election 08/06/2017

[Mister M]

On the issue of Tim Farron's views on homosexuality:

In the Commons Nigel Evans, the Conservative MP who is gay, asks Tim Farron if he thinks that being gay is a sin.

 

“No, I do not,” says Farron.

[biotechpete]

Whatever would need to be done to make it representative.

 

The point is, it would at least be a vote about the sort of brexit we wanted and not muddy the waters by mixing in all the other things people consider when voting in a general election.

 

My personal view is that she should not be seeking an election now. She should do the negotiation, tell us what she's got then go to the people in a general election or a referendum. That way we get the option of endorsing her brexit (realistically the best brexit possible) or no brexit with full knowledge of the position facing us.

 

She knows brexit will be a pile of **** so she's seeking the 'mandate' now so she can weather the storm. It's for personal gain not the interest of the country.

[altus]

My personal view is that she should not be seeking an election now. She should do the negotiation, tell us what she's got then go to the people in a general election or a referendum. That way we get the option of endorsing her brexit (realistically the best brexit possible) or no brexit with full knowledge of the position facing us.

I disagree. That would be leaving us with the choice between hard brexit and even harder brexit (A.K.A. default to WTO trade rules).

She knows brexit will be a pile of **** so she's seeking the 'mandate' now so she can weather the storm. It's for personal gain not the interest of the country.

The whole thing is an onmishambles. What was an attempt to stop the divisions within the Conservative party has resulted in dividing the country as well.

[sgtkate]

Regarding manifestos I completely agree however at the last election I believe only the Torys and UKIP promised an eu referendum. If the voting system was fairer I'd of gone UKIP but as they had no chance of getting in the only option was Tory.

I am working class but Tory still felt the best bet, upto the others to persuade me otherwise this time but at the moment only the Torys seem flexible about the single market where as the rest it seem a case of we must be in it at any cost, that doesn't sit well with me when it come to the negotiations.

 

Ok, how can I convince you? Why do you feel the Tories are the right party for you?

 

---------- Post added 19-04-2017 at 14:54 ----------

 

On the issue of Tim Farron's views on homosexuality:

In the Commons Nigel Evans, the Conservative MP who is gay, asks Tim Farron if he thinks that being gay is a sin.

 

“No, I do not,” says Farron.

 

Thank heavens for that...now I can legitimately put LD back on my list. I'm fairly sure Labour are a utter shoe in where I live and the greens are unlikely to field a candidate so it'll be nice to be able to vote with my heart for a change and not tactically as I have up to now. I will not support Kevin Barron as he has voted totally against my views on several key topics and I said on here I'd not support him unless I felt forced to to stop UKIP, I don't think I'm faced with that scenario so looks like LDs will be getting at least one vote in Rother Valley!

 

As I say, a Labour shoe-in:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/politics/constituencies/E14000903

[biotechpete]

I disagree. That would be leaving us with the choice between hard brexit and even harder brexit (A.K.A. default to WTO trade rules).

The whole thing is an onmishambles. What was an attempt to stop the divisions within the Conservative party has resulted in dividing the country as well.

 

If the vote was held before final exit, there is the reasonable expectation that article 50 could be withdrawn, which is the other option I was suggesting. I'm not personally convinced that May will come back with a deal any better than WTO terms in any case.

[L00b]

If the vote was held before final exit, there is the reasonable expectation that article 50 could be withdrawn, which is the other option I was suggesting. I'm not personally convinced that May will come back with a deal any better than WTO terms in any case.

It's not May's call.

 

It's not even the UK's call if someone pro-EU replaced May in a GE in 2 months' time or before March 2019.

 

That's the one elephant in the room which has been consistently papered over since June last year (and before by pro-Leavers here and elsewhere), with a new layer being applied with this new GE: most here and elsewhere continue to see this Brexiting exercise with a parochial myopia, refusing to countenance the notion that negotiation means giving and taking from both sides of the table, according to the balance of power between the respective parties...and now constrained by a ticking clock since 31 March 2017.

 

Any negotiation takes 2 sides to tango. Doesn't matter if, or how often, one dancer steps on its own appendage feet, rearranges its clothing, smoothes its hair, pauses for breath <...> That dancer isn't tango'ing alone. And the EU has been, and shall continue to, leading the dance de facto since Article 50 letter went in. Because no signatures on paper by end March 2019 and it's out without any deal.

 

tic-toc-tic-toc-tic-toc-tic-toc-tic-toc...

 

PS: don't kid yourself that the EU27 wouldn't want their cake and eating it pound of flesh for consenting to withdraw the Article 50 letter. You could kiss that rebate goodbye, for starters.

Edited April 19, 2017 by L00b

[Jacktari]

They have fallen into her trap anyway.

They have just voted to have a GE as she wanted.

So it is hard brexit, and no elections until 2022; that is, if she deems one necessary and in the her interests.

 

It seems she learned from her visits to Erdogan and Trump.

[NERVY-OWL]

Ok, how can I convince you? Why do you feel the Tories are the right party for you?

 

---------- Post added 19-04-2017 at 14:54 ----------

 

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You can't convince me, thats upto the other partys to do. I don't know if they are but as I said before my decsion will more than likely be based on the brexit plans of each party, so far Torys are winning.

[biotechpete]

It's not May's call.

 

It's not even the UK's call if someone pro-EU replaced May in a GE in 2 months' time or before March 2019.

 

That's the one elephant in the room which has been consistently papered over since June last year (and before by pro-Leavers here and elsewhere), with a new layer being applied with this new GE: any negotiation takes 2 side to tango.

 

Doesn't matter if, or how often, one dancer steps on its own appendage feet, rearranges its clothing, smoothes its hair, pauses for breath <...> That dancer isn't tango'ing alone. And the EU has been, and shall continue to, leading the dance de facto since Article 50 letter went in. Because no signatures on paper by end March 2019 and it's out without any deal.

 

tic-toc-tic-toc-tic-toc-tic-toc-tic-toc...

 

PS: don't kid yourself that the EU27 wouldn't want their cake and eating it pound of flesh for consenting to withdraw the Article 50 letter. You could kiss that rebate goodbye, for starters.

 

Lord Kerr the author of article 50 and a couple of other constitutional lawyers say that the Article 50 notice can be withdrawn at any point before a deal is voted upon by the EU, unilaterally. They say a country cannot be forced to leave.

 

Barnier seems to disagree, so much so that he had it written into the EU negotiating document. But the document is not legally binding and the position hasn't been tested in court.

[nowt2pctoday]

interesting times we live in?