Why isn't the debt calculator on our screens?

[Litotes]

You've mentioned 30 Billion for HS2, do you imagine that it's already been spent?

Perhaps you could find out how much has actually been spent on HS2 since 2010?

 

In 2015 about £1B had already been spent.

[Cyclone]

​

 

 

Leaving the EU isn't technically guaranteed anyway. Article 50 can be reversed at any point up unil 29 March 2019.

 

As many have said you can't keep holding referendums in the hope the next one yields the result you want. The EU referendum was a once in lifetime opportunity to fundamentally change our relationship with the European Union.

 

The democratic will of the people voted to leave, and the government of the day have the responsibility to deliver on that. That's how democracy works.

 

All the political parties have said they accept the outcome of the referendum.

 

Suggesting anything to the contrary would fundamentally put our democracy on very shaky ground.

 

This sounds like the excuse of someone who's scared that another referendum would show that the "will of the people" has changed, having realised just how badly they were lied to.

 

---------- Post added 30-04-2017 at 11:28 ----------

 

It's why large swathes of the Yorkshire region are expected to turn blue.

 

Fake news?

[El Cid]

As many have said you can't keep holding referendums in the hope the next one yields the result you want. The EU referendum was a once in lifetime opportunity to fundamentally change our relationship with the European Union.

 

 

Its Theresa May that seems to want this referendum to be about the EU.

[I1L2T3]

This isn't a debate about HS2. I'm asking what policies bought in since 2010 have caused the increase in the National Debt. HS2 is not one of them, for the reasons I stated.

 

Austerity was a key policy that caused a lot of issues.

 

It stalled growth which greatly reduced the revenue for HMRC which led to more borrowin than expected.

 

We had 3 years of well below par growth.

 

When growth returned it was still below what was required to meet deficit reduction targets.

 

Now the Tories have abandoned deficit reduction as a headline policy.

 

---------- Post added 30-04-2017 at 11:49 ----------

 

Its Theresa May that seems to want this referendum to be about the EU.

 

Yes it's effectively another referendum on a single issue that allows them to not have to commit to any manifesto before hand.

 

A lot of voters seem to care about Brexit to the exclusion of anything else and May is playing to that. Those who aren't well off and vote on that basis really and absolutely deserve everything that's coming their way. This is not going to be pretty.

[Cyclone]

It's not that the tories didn't want to reduce the deficit, austerity was supposedly an attempt to do so. It's just that it failed. And after it failed (and other countries demonstrated that the alternative was better) they continued with it anyway.

I suppose it's helpful to claim 'austerity' as you defund the NHS in order to cause it to appear to fail and to set it up for privatisation, for example.

 

 

Yes it's effectively another referendum on a single issue that allows them to not have to commit to any manifesto before hand.

 

A lot of voters seem to care about Brexit to the exclusion of anything else and May is playing to that. Those who aren't well off and vote on that basis really and absolutely deserve everything that's coming their way. This is not going to be pretty.

 

It also has the advantage of allowing the tories to remove the 30 MPs who are under investigation for electoral fraud before they're removed by the legal process, which would then cause the government to fail due to no longer having a majority... Pretty sneaky to be honest.

Edited April 30, 2017 by Groose

[Vaati]

Name calling is not going to be tolerated under any circumstance. A post has been removed and any further name calling will likely end in suspensions.

[Puggie]

The point I was making was it's far to early to fully appreciate the outcome of Brexit.

 

There will be grumblings and turbulence during the negotiating period but thankfully there's an expiry date to bring proceedings to an end.

 

There will be bitter elements within society who simply cannot wait for a "told you so" opportunity to arise.

[Cyclone]

So you're saying that we're taking a leap into the unknown with the future of multiple generations and our economy.

Forgive me if I think that's a really stupid thing to do.

[Anna B]

I think the point is that the Conservatives won the last election on a downright lie - That Labour crashed the economy.

 

They didn't.

 

But the Conservatives kept repeating it over and over at every opportunity, brainwashing the public with a simple soundbite that simply wasn't true. As Joseph Goebbells said, 'repeat a lie often enough and big enough and it becomes the truth...'

 

The truth of course was so complex I'm not sure people understand it even now, and any attempt to explain it fell on deaf ears. Which is a pity, as it could well happen all over again, and soon, with even more devastating consequences, thanks to the Tories allowing the dubious and often criminal banking practices to continue.

 

We now have a new Conservative mantra, that they are a 'safe and secure pair of hands,' no truer than the last one and once again without an ounce of evidence to back it up.

Edited April 30, 2017 by Anna B

[Puggie]

So you're saying that we're taking a leap into the unknown with the future of multiple generations and our economy.

Forgive me if I think that's a really stupid thing to do.

 

We didn't begin life as members of the European Union, heck even the EU itself is unrecognizable from its original inception of a trading bloc.

 

Have we really forgotten how an independent sovereign state operates? Perhaps it's a good thing we're being forced to look beyond the European bubble.