The Consequences of Brexit [part 4]

[silentP]

To use this latest analogy

 

It isn't a journey, we aren't going anywhere, we're all staying here on this side of the road to see if things can be done a little differently. Who knows, maybe its the silly brexiters keeping everyone else from danger!

[Carlinate]

Well said. Too many people on here seem to ignore the fact our country voted for it.

 

---------- Post added 25-06-2017 at 07:24 ----------

 

Probably the most bias post I have read from a sore loser on here. It seems to have escaped you, the fact the majority our country decided by a democratic process they wanted to embark on the journey.

 

And the inaccuracies in my post were?

 

You used the word fact in that comment, unusual for a Brexiteer.

 

Facts are good, hopes and dreams and fantasies of sunlit uplands and rivers of milk and honey are delusional, and damaging if acted upon without any actual means of delivery.

 

So, please supply us with some facts which will assure us that the country is heading for a bright future.

 

Please explain how leaving the most successful Trade Bloc in the World is going to be to our advantage.

 

Please help us understand how we are going to take advantage of all the new opportunities despite not having taken every opportunity to do so whilst a member of the EU.

 

Germany,France,Italy and the Netherlands are all more successful exporters than we are, what is going to change and why?

 

I'm sure all us 'sore losers' are anxious to have some reassurance that all will be well in the best of all possible worlds.

 

After all, unlike our former EU partners we don't even have schadenfreude to look forward to.

 

We, together with our immediate family live here, if it turns out as bad as we think ( and nothing so far is reassuring us ) then we will pay the price just like those who brought it about.

 

So please cheer us up and explain how we are worrying unnecessarily.

 

Don't forget to stick to facts your optimistic opinion is just that, your opinion.

[Lord Rex]

And the inaccuracies in my post were?

 

You used the word fact in that comment, unusual for a Brexiteer.

 

Facts are good, hopes and dreams and fantasies of sunlit uplands and rivers of milk and honey are delusional, and damaging if acted upon without any actual means of delivery.

 

So, please supply us with some facts which will assure us that the country is heading for a bright future.

 

Please explain how leaving the most successful Trade Bloc in the World is going to be to our advantage.

 

Please help us understand how we are going to take advantage of all the new opportunities despite not having taken every opportunity to do so whilst a member of the EU.

 

Germany,France,Italy and the Netherlands are all more successful exporters than we are, what is going to change and why?

 

I'm sure all us 'sore losers' are anxious to have some reassurance that all will be well in the best of all possible worlds.

 

After all, unlike our former EU partners we don't even have schadenfreude to look forward to.

 

We, together with our immediate family live here, if it turns out as bad as we think ( and nothing so far is reassuring us ) then we will pay the price just like those who brought it about.

 

So please cheer us up and explain how we are worrying unnecessarily.

 

Don't forget to stick to facts your optimistic opinion is just that, your opinion.

You're the sore loser who is making predictions about our country's future. I have made no wild guesses or predictions. All I have stated is that the democratic people voted to leave the EU and those wishes should be respected. I don't care if the UK is worse off or better off as a consequence of leaving the EU, but I do care that the wishes of the people who voted in a democratic referendum last year should be respected for better or worse. If you are not happy with our country leaving the EU, then why don't you leave the UK and move to one of the 27 EU countries who have not voted to leave. I will be moving to New Zealand permanently, if either the UK does not leave the EU completely or a piece of vermin like Jerry Corbin is ever elected our Prime Minister. I certainly won't be a sore loser like you posting arrogant nonsense on here, if things what I wish for don't happen or if things I don't want to happen, occur.

[Hairyloon]

All I have stated is that the democratic people voted to leave the EU and those wishes should be respected...

 

Why? What makes them worthy of respect?

[Sidonica]

You're the sore loser who is making predictions about our country's future. I have made no wild guesses or predictions. All I have stated is that the democratic people voted to leave the EU and those wishes should be respected. I don't care if the UK is worse off or better off as a consequence of leaving the EU, but I do care that the wishes of the people who voted in a democratic referendum last year should be respected for better or worse. If you are not happy with our country leaving the EU, then why don't you leave the UK and move to one of the 27 EU countries who have not voted to leave. I will be moving to New Zealand permanently, if either the UK does not leave the EU completely or a piece of vermin like Jerry Corbin is ever elected our Prime Minister. I certainly won't be a sore loser like you posting arrogant nonsense on here, if things what I wish for don't happen or if things I don't want to happen, occur.

 

So, a remainer has to move to the EU to respect the wishes of the referendum when no one voted for a hard or soft brexit just brexit but if you don't get what you want you will be leaving for New Zealand ? You'll like it there.

[Carlinate]

. I don't care if the UK is worse off or better off as a consequence of leaving the EU,

 

Sums up the inanity of the Brexiteers perfectly.

 

 

So in reality you don't have any facts which would indicate some measure of optimism about what's taking place?

 

When did this blind love of democracy take over from your ability for rational thinking?

 

Have you ever protested against our ridiculously undemocratic voting system for instance?

 

Not one single political party has taken office as the government of this country with even 50% of votes cast in a general election since 1945.

 

Tony Blairs New Labour won the 2005 with just 35.2% of the votes cast meaning that 64.8% of the voting electorate wanted a different outcome.

 

Were you incandescent with rage at the time, or is your love of democracy a new found thing?

 

The current Conservative government obtained 42.4% of votes cast, despite which it is a minority government unlike Blairs.

 

New Zealand is lovely, you'll enjoy it.

[apelike]

 

So, please supply us with some facts which will assure us that the country is heading for a bright future.

 

Supplying facts to an unknown is a bit hard, maybe you could supply some facts to show the opposite?

 

Please explain how leaving the most successful Trade Bloc in the World is going to be to our advantage.

 

It may be a successful trade bloc but that is the problem with statistics in classing it as a whole. We don't actually trade with the EU as such but trade with members in it and quite a few of those members we actually do very little trade with. There is nothing stopping us trading with them after Brexit is there?

 

Germany,France,Italy and the Netherlands are all more successful exporters than we are, what is going to change and why?

 

Maybe its because they have stuff to export..

[Guest sibon]

There is nothing stopping us trading with them after Brexit is there?

 

 

 

There may well be, depending on the exact circumstances.

 

As an absolute minimum, we will pay more for stuff that we buy from the EU. That's not good news for anyone.

[Lord Rex]

Sums up the inanity of the Brexiteers perfectly.

 

 

So in reality you don't have any facts which would indicate some measure of optimism about what's taking place?

 

When did this blind love of democracy take over from your ability for rational thinking?

 

Have you ever protested against our ridiculously undemocratic voting system for instance?

 

Not one single political party has taken office as the government of this country with even 50% of votes cast in a general election since 1945.

 

Tony Blairs New Labour won the 2005 with just 35.2% of the votes cast meaning that 64.8% of the voting electorate wanted a different outcome.

 

Were you incandescent with rage at the time, or is your love of democracy a new found thing?

 

The current Conservative government obtained 42.4% of votes cast, despite which it is a minority government unlike Blairs.

 

New Zealand is lovely, you'll enjoy it.

In general elections we have a first past the post system, which normally delivers a ruling party with a clear majority. The system works fine even when there are coalitions governments, if there is an hung parliament. Referendums are a two horse race and the winner is the option which attracts over 50% of all votes cast. That is how democracy works in our country. I never complained when Tony Blair won the election in 2005, even though I didn't vote for him, because I respect the wishes of the people who voted for him and I respect how democracy works in our country.

 

If there were prizes for sore loses posting repetitive sour grape nonsense, then you would be near the front of the queue for an award.

 

---------- Post added 25-06-2017 at 14:35 ----------

 

Why? What makes them worthy of respect?

Leave had the majority of votes. Honest civilised people respect the results of elections.

[Carlinate]

Supplying facts to an unknown is a bit hard, maybe you could supply some facts to show the opposite?

 

 

 

It may be a successful trade bloc but that is the problem with statistics in classing it as a whole. We don't actually trade with the EU as such but trade with members in it and quite a few of those members we actually do very little trade with. There is nothing stopping us trading with them after Brexit is there?

 

 

 

Maybe its because they have stuff to export..

 

" Supplying facts to an unknown is a bit hard ".

 

Precisely.

 

Brexiteers have taken us into the unknown and apparently expect us to be happy about it and not question the wisdom of making such a non rational decision based more on antipathy to the EU ( the workings of which few of them understand ) rather than any genuine reasons as to how it will improve our country's future prospects.

 

" There's nothing stopping us trading with them after Brexit is there? "

 

If they are members of the EU then it is the EU that we would be dealing with, not the individual country.

 

As I said above, few Brexiteers appear to understand the workings of the EU.

 

Should we be operating under WTO rules by that time then we wouldn't be able to offer a particular country preferential deals anyway as there is a principle of non-discrimination in WTO rules.

 

" Maybe it's because they have stuff to export ".

 

Again, precisely!

 

Leaving a world recognised trade organisation and striking out into the unknown without a safety net is risky even if you have stuff to export that other countries consider essential, without that positive it seems extremely foolish.

 

---------- Post added 25-06-2017 at 15:36 ----------

 

In general elections we have a first past the post system, which normally delivers a ruling party with a clear majority. The system works fine even when there are coalitions governments, if there is an hung parliament. Referendums are a two horse race and the winner is the option which attracts over 50% of all votes cast. That is how democracy works in our country. I never complained when Tony Blair won the election in 2005, even though I didn't vote for him, because I respect the wishes of the people who voted for him and I respect how democracy works in our country.

 

If there were prizes for sore loses posting repetitive sour grape nonsense, then you would be near the front of the queue for an award.

 

---------- Post added 25-06-2017 at 14:35 ----------

 

Leave had the majority of votes. Honest civilised people respect the results of elections.

 

Obviously you have difficulty understanding how democracy works.

 

The FPTP system is unfit for purpose, it doesn't return a result which reflects the peoples wishes which is supposed to be the whole point of a citizen vote.

 

However the politicians prefer this system because it suits them. They are supposed to be serving us but have managed to reverse the process in their favour.

 

Which is why when they offered us a chance to change the system we were only given the opportunity to choose between FPTP and another flawed system AV.

 

The most democratic voting system as yet devised by man has been used in a part of the UK since 1973 without a problem so why wasn't it offered as the alternative?

 

Because it is impossible to argue the merits of FPTP against PR, and the politicians didn't want to change so imposed their wishes over the wishes of the people.

 

As far as the referendum is concerned it was blindingly apparent that many Brexiteers had no idea what they were voting for and many voted based on the bogeyman image which had been projected by various British governments using the EU excuse to cover up their own shortcomings.

 

People voted leave because of immigration despite over 50% of it being from outside the EU and the direct responsibility of the UK government.

 

People voted leave because cheap Chinese steel was impacting on our steel industry, unaware that the EU put forward a proposal to impose tariffs and those proposals were vetoed by the UK.

 

People voted leave because they wanted " to take back control " this despite the fact that whilst we have been involved in Europe we have fought wars in Argentina,Iraq,Afghanistan, bombed Libya and considered going to war in Syria. We refused to join the Euro or sign up for Schengen and have a veto on EU decisions.

 

None of the Brexiteers can clarify precisely what piece of control they need which will justify the losses we are going to suffer.

 

We have been pushed into a process which will harm the country by the ill informed.

 

The very least we need is another referendum by the British people on the final deal after it has been accepted by the 27 remaining EU members because make no mistake our fate is in their hands and has been placed there by such as you.

 

Someone who intends to run away if it doesn't work out as you wish!