apelike Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 I really don't get your point? You seem to be saying my point is invalid because if the economy were to grow my points would occur? Err, no. You are suggesting that if the economy grows then we should see "an alleviation of funding crises in our healthcare, welfare, education and local governments? " I am pointing out that just because the economy grows it does not follow that we should see the bit in bold as you have made out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Car Boot Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 All the reports, from various organisations, point in the same direction. There are no counterpart reports (that I know of) that model a future where we are better off under Brexit than we would have been if we didn’t leave. There were no official reports that modelled a future where we would be economically better off by staying out of the Euro currency either. Not adopting the Euro would only spell doom for the UK, so the economists warned. I wonder how that turned out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENG601PM Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 All the reports, from various organisations, point in the same direction. There are no counterpart reports (that I know of) that model a future where we are better off under Brexit than we would have been if we didn’t leave. The ‘plans’ that leading Brexiters have presented have frequently and quickly fallen apart. Facts. I've continually said that I'm no fan of macroeconomic predictions so I have tried to argue from that position but you really do want to reframe the discussion so I'll concede for a moment. I'll humour you and give you your 'facts' even though you can't do the same for your Remain position. Look at Economists For Free Trade. Fill your boots with reasons to exit the EU from macroeconomists with a track record of being right. https://www.economistsforfreetrade.com Always try to be have won the battle before the opposition arrives. You didn't really think that I'd turn up to a knife fight without a hand grenade in my pocket did you? And I STILL think that macroeconomic predictions are for mugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 Rubbish .... It’s not rubbish, unfortunately. There is no credible report that models higher GDP growth if we leave. The main leave campaign knew that, and it’s why economic debate was stifled. Dominic Cummings said this post-referendum: “Would we have won by spending our time talking about trade and the Single Market? No way.” There is nothing that points to a brighter economic future. There are ideas for sure, like the idea we’d spend these two years cementing trade deals with the rest of the world. That hasn’t happened. What has happened is predictions of slower growth, falling inward investment etc... are coming true and it’s no wonder you don’t want to talk about any of that. ---------- Post added 03-02-2018 at 08:27 ---------- I've continually said that I'm no fan of macroeconomic predictions so I have tried to argue from that position but you really do want to reframe the discussion so I'll concede for a moment. I'll humour you and give you your 'facts' even though you can't do the same for your Remain position. Look at Economists For Free Trade. Fill your boots with reasons to exit the EU from macroeconomists with a track record of being right. https://www.economistsforfreetrade.com Always try to be have won the battle before the opposition arrives. You didn't really think that I'd turn up to a knife fight without a hand grenade in my pocket did you? And I STILL think that macroeconomic predictions are for mugs. The Chair of economists for free trade is Patrick Mingord. Want me to start digging out some quotes from him about the destruction of British manufacturing? Happy to oblige. Think that hand grenade just went off in your pocket Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tzijlstra Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 Err, no. You are suggesting that if the economy grows then we should see "an alleviation of funding crises in our healthcare, welfare, education and local governments? " I am pointing out that just because the economy grows it does not follow that we should see the bit in bold as you have made out. So you don’t think the Tories have a desire to invest more in the NHS if they had more money to play with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 It’s the last thing the Tories want to do. They are deliberately underfunding the NHS as it is. Brexit wouldn’t change that. What Brexit would possibly allow is a wholesale renationalisation of outsourced NHS services without reference to EU competition law. That is where the Tories better be careful with how they handle Brexit. As always governments often inadvertently pave the ground for unforeseen actions by subsequent governments. Labour has shown its intent in some ways this week with the plans to smash up land banking by forcing the sale of land at agricultural prices. Any number of privatised services could be treated in similar ways post-Brexit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENG601PM Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 It’s not rubbish, unfortunately. There is no credible report that models higher GDP growth if we leave. The main leave campaign knew that, and it’s why economic debate was stifled. Dominic Cummings said this post-referendum: “Would we have won by spending our time talking about trade and the Single Market? No way.” There is nothing that points to a brighter economic future. There are ideas for sure, like the idea we’d spend these two years cementing trade deals with the rest of the world. That hasn’t happened. What has happened is predictions of slower growth, falling inward investment etc... are coming true and it’s no wonder you don’t want to talk about any of that. ---------- Post added 03-02-2018 at 08:27 ---------- The Chair of economists for free trade is Patrick Mingord. Want me to start digging out some quotes from him about the destruction of British manufacturing? Happy to oblige. Sorry chum, you're a busted flush. You asked, you got, and it's still a mugs game. Yet you cling on to the EU and it's vested interests like a child to its mother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 Cling to the idea of a stable economic future. Instead of throwing in your lot with a bunch of swivel eyed fanatics dreaming of the days of empire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Car Boot Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 Cling to the idea of a stable economic future. Instead of throwing in your lot with a bunch of swivel eyed fanatics dreaming of the days of empire. Ah. You mean people like Peter Mandelson, who dreams of an EU empire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENG601PM Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 Cling to the idea of a stable economic future. Instead of throwing in your lot with a bunch of swivel eyed fanatics dreaming of the days of empire. EU federalisation is exactly that. None so blind, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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