The Consequences of Brexit [part 4]

[Fogey]

I have done one or two negotiations in my time, and I do to agree with what you say. Negotiations involve two sides who have a similar outcome in mind but often with very different issues to input. A good negotiation resolves the differences as far as possible and that involves compromise for both parties.

 

The UK has to deliver Brexit. The EU27 have to deliver Brexit too. There's the common output.

 

By default, the EU27 can only present a single unified position because it is impossible to have 28 parties negotiating, but that's not to say that it is an agreed position by each of the EU27. That is the EU's achilles heel in a nutshell; different nations have very different priorities and requirements, from agriculture to tourism, human rights to immigration. The only thing that they agree on is that they want their respective national economies to succeed so that they get voted in again.

 

Then we have the various institutions of the EU. They also want to hold on to power, and they do this with a through votes, but primarily by redistribution of wealth.

 

The UK is in quite a luxurious and consequently very strong position. It can present a unified negotiation according to government policy. However this is where we begin to fail because the present PM hasn't shown the stomach to push through individual matters and play to the strength, relying instead on mantras like "Brexit is Brexit", "red lines" and "no deal is better than a bad deal". These truisms are political nonsense that makes headlines, not agreements.

 

Remember what I said about what the EU27 agrees on? That is to the UK's advantage. National economic interests will trump politics - mark my words, they nearly always do, and where political ideology wins we see failed nations.

 

Remember what I said about how the EU holds onto power? The EU is already broke and corrupt, and therefore unauditable. The UK's money is the only thing that will keep it going. This isn't even up for debate because the EU will collapse without the UK's financial muscle long into the future.

 

So yes, the UK's negotiation, at least the visible part we see, has been generally poor but don't make the mistake of thinking that the UK is like a helpless child who will have to roll over.

 

These high level fundamentals should be quite clear to somebody with a little negotiating experience. It takes good leadership to conclude a good negotiation with ease but my expectation while writing this today is that the respective EU27 governments and the EU itself will have to succumb to the national economic interests, which is a good Brexit for the EU.

 

Everything you have described here as a negative for the EU also applies to the UK. You make it sound like the UK is one homogeneous whole where every person, village, city, count, region and indeed separate country shares the same goals and priorities. As for the idea the EU is broke, what's the UK's deficit and debt at the minute?

[ENG601PM]

Everything you have described here as a negative for the EU also applies to the UK. You make it sound like the UK is one homogeneous whole where every person, village, city, count, region and indeed separate country shares the same goals and priorities. As for the idea the EU is broke, what's the UK's deficit and debt at the minute?

 

Do you want just negative, or negative squared and multiplied to the power of 28?

[chalga]

No it isn't clear. You appear confused and to not really understand what you're trying to say so you're conflating different things. Brexit, federalisation, budgets, viability, trade deals - these are all really different things.

 

Let's break it down and make it easier for both of us, but especially you. Make one point, ask one question. Which do you want to address first? Please try not to go over old ground otherwise I'll just tell you to go find what I've written before.

 

Just try to answer the simple questions in 6881,,or any other question that has been put to you for that matter,try and at least make an effort to have a tiny bit of credibility on here.

[truman]

Do you want just negative, or negative squared and multiplied to the power of 28?

 

A negative squared becomes a positive...

[ENG601PM]

Just try to answer the simple questions in 6881,,or any other question that has been put to you for that matter,try and at least make an effort to have a tiny bit of credibility on here.

 

Try again.

 

---------- Post added 28-02-2018 at 14:59 ----------

 

A negative squared becomes a positive...

 

Very good truman although you are well aware that I was seeking to avoid alliteration in the rhetoric rather than accuracy in the scientific notation. Very sharp all the same, but now you've got me posing over the strict implications of just what constitutes squared and multiplied to the power.

Edited February 28, 2018 by ENG601PM

[chalga]

Try again.

 

Pick any of the sentences in post 6881,with a question mark after them,you know,that's a question to you,and have a go at answering it,just one will do.

After that,we might get a sensible debate going about your points,and then we might eventually move on to the other sentences in post 6881 with a question mark at the end,more questions to you.

[Fogey]

Do you want just negative, or negative squared and multiplied to the power of 28?

 

So you’ve resorted to nonsense when unable to form a viable argument.

[I1L2T3]

Why can’t some people still not understand that the EU is a collection of 28 countries, not some standalone nefarious multi-headed hydra.

[melthebell]

Why can’t some people still not understand that the EU is a collection of 28 countries, not some standalone nefarious multi-headed hydra.

 

and the only country that seems to be feeling hard done by by the multi headed hydra....is us

 

 

[phil752]

Why can’t some people still not understand that the EU is a collection of 28 countries, not some standalone nefarious multi-headed hydra.

 

thought it is now 27?

 

---------- Post added 28-02-2018 at 20:29 ----------

 

and the only country that seems to be feeling hard done by by the multi headed hydra....is us

 

 

 

Are you really sure about that? but I like your comparison of hydra to the EU, thinking of the EU as Hydra, which I agree should all the other 27 not be alarmed.

Edited February 28, 2018 by phil752