Car Boot Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 Democracy includes changing your mind. You obviously deny the democratic process like so many of the leavers. So lets have a petition for a second referendum or is that not democratic? Let's all respect the democratic outcome of the last referendum and actually get out of the EU before we have another purely to completely reverse the result of the last one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hackey lad Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 You seem equally confused about the democratic process as the average leaver It is being respected, we are leaving the EU. We have no idea which permutation of this "wish" each leave voter wants, they were never asked. If we ask them now, the majority want a CU & SM agreement (Norway style). It doesn't matter how many times you say it, it doesn't make it true. Again, we are leaving the EU. He also said he wouldn't resign A second referendum wouldn't be about membership of the EU, it would be about the terms of our exit and the relationship with the EU going forward. And if people were not happy after the second referendum ., then what Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJRB Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 Let's all respect the democratic outcome of the last referendum and actually get out of the EU before we have another purely to completely reverse the result of the last one. You seem determined to leave whatever the terms,and whatever the cost. I think that the majority of voters would admit that they are better informed on the subject than they were at the time of the referendum. We won’t get another referendum but I really do hope that the government are prevented from railroading through a settlement that disadvantages the U.K. in the name of “the will of the people” They will soon discover that the will of the people may not be as strong as it appeared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Car Boot Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 We have no idea which permutation of this "wish" each leave voter wants, they were never asked. If we ask them now, the majority want a CU & SM agreement (Norway style). No. A majority of 1062 Leave voters polled by Populus want a customs union and single market agreement. To attempt to portray this very tiny sample as being in any way shape or form the majority view of 17.4 million Leave voters is simply bad science and morally dubious. The intent being to direct, rather than measure, public opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lockdoctor Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 David Cameron made it clear that if the UK voted to leave the EU, it would mean the UK would be leaving the single market. He said it 28 times in one interview. Voters were aware of this before the referendum vote. Listen to what he said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexo Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 David Cameron made it clear that if the UK voted to leave the EU, it would mean the UK would be leaving the single market. He said it 28 times in one interview. Theresa May and David Davis said a new "comprehensive free trade agreement and a comprehensive customs agreement" would deliver "the exact same benefits as we have [now]" after the UK leaves. I think the easiest way to have "the exact same benefits" is to stay in the single market and customs union and therefore not bother with all the hassle. Davis, Boris, Farage and co cannot deliver their Brexit promises because they are contradictory. It's a mess of the politicians' own making so those who voted for Brexit because they wanted to give the politicians a good kicking have had their willing and can enjoy watching as Brexit crashes into reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magilla Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 (edited) David Cameron made it clear that if the UK voted to leave the EU, it would mean the UK would be leaving the single market. He said it 28 times in one interview. Voters were aware of this before the referendum vote. Listen to what he said And all the leading Brexiters said we could stay in the single market:- https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/open-britain-video-single-market-nigel-farage-anna-soubry_uk_582ce0a0e4b09025ba310fce What did Cameron say about the customs union? Edited May 2, 2018 by Magilla Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lockdoctor Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 And all the leading Brexiters said we could stay in the single market:- https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/open-britain-video-single-market-nigel-farage-anna-soubry_uk_582ce0a0e4b09025ba310fce What did Cameron say about the customs union? By leading Brexiters do you include Boris Johnson. Gove, Mrs Leadsom and NigeL Farage who all stated the UK would not be in the single market, if the UK voted to leave? ---------- Post added 02-05-2018 at 07:47 ---------- What did Cameron say about the customs union? Remind me, if you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magilla Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 (edited) By leading Brexiters do you include Boris Johnson. Gove, Mrs Leadsom and NigeL Farage who all stated the UK would not be in the single market, if the UK voted to leave? Fair doo's, however the official Vote Leave campaign never made such a claim: https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2017/08/take-it-vote-leave-staffer-there-no-mandate-quit-single-market Also: "Wouldn't it be terrible if we were really like Norway and Switzerland? Really? They're rich. They're happy. They're self-governing" Nigel Farage "Only a madman would actually leave the Market" Owen Paterson MP "Increasingly, the Norway option looks the best for the UK" Arron Banks "The idea of staying within a common market, but outside a political union, I think that is feasable" Dan Hannan. Given how clear cut it was you can see why only 35% of those who voted Leave in the 2016 referendum expected Britain to leave the Single Market as a result: https://www.markpack.org.uk/154126/leave-voters-expected-britain-stay-single-market/ I guess that's why a majority want to stay within it (and thought we would be). We'll have to wait and see but, with the exception of Farage, a year or two before the referendum Johnson, Gove & Leadsom were all saying leaving the single market would be economic disaster! Funny how things change init Members of parliament who're accountable to their constituants will have a better idea of public feeling, so fortunately, the Lords just gave them the power to do what is in the UKs and publics best interest when the time comes. Remind me, if you know. So you didn't know *exactly* what you were voting for... hmmm I tell you what, you can have a little search Then you'll be able to tell me if you think the referendum gives a mandate to leave the customs union too? Edited May 2, 2018 by Magilla Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Litotes Posted May 2, 2018 Share Posted May 2, 2018 Fair doo's, however The official Vote Leave campaign never made such a claim: https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2017/08/take-it-vote-leave-staffer-there-no-mandate-quit-single-market Also: "Wouldn't it be terrible if we were really like Norway and Switzerland? Really? They're rich. They're happy. They're self-governing" Nigel Farage "Only a madman would actually leave the Market" Owen Paterson MP "Increasingly, the Norway option looks the best for the UK" Arron Banks "The idea of staying within a common market, but outside a political union, I think that is feasable" Dan Hannan. Given how clear cut it was you can see why only 35% of those who voted Leave in the 2016 referendum expected Britain to leave the Single Market as a result: https://www.markpack.org.uk/154126/leave-voters-expected-britain-stay-single-market/ I guess that's why a majority want to stay within it (and thought we would be). We'll have to wait and see but, with the exception of Farage, a year or two before the referendum Johnson, Gove & Leadsom were all saying leaving the single market would be economic disaster! Funny how things change init Members of parliament who're accountable to their constituants will have a better idea of public feeling, so fortunately, the Lords just gave them the power to do what is in the UKs and publics best interest when the time comes. I tell you what, you can have a little search Then you'll be able to tell me if you think the referendum gives a mandate to leave the customs union too? As you quote Farage can I remnd you... "'In a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long way." - Nigel Farage 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts