Until all men have learned how to behave..

[ENG601PM]

A world without men would be really boring so I think that it is a rubbish idea because there will be no men to buy the drinks for all the women

[Fogey]

Well, you want to stop her having an opinion and taking some action based on that opinion.

 

Sure, try to talk to her, I bet she actually knows that it's a tiny minority that are the problem. But since you can't identify them in any way how to you guarantee the safety of women at a festival that has had a historical problem with sexual assault and rape?

 

I don't want to stop her having an opinion, I want her to change her opinion if she really believes all men need to learn how to behave.

 

If she knows it is only a small minority of men then she shouldn't be publicly blaming all men.

 

You're advocating that it is Ok to treat whole sections of society differently because of the actions of a very small minority within that demographic, you're on a very slippery slope with regards both your moral and legal footing.

Edited July 12, 2017 by nikki-red
fixed the quote

[Andy1976]

 

You're advocating that it is Ok to treat whole sections of society differently because of the actions of a very small minority within that demographic, you're on a very slippery slope with regards both your moral and legal footing.

 

Indeed - the Equality Act would have a fair amount to say about this I'm sure.

[Cyclone]

Would it? Because swimming pools can run women only sessions, gyms can be women only, so what part of the equality act would stop a private festival being organised that was women only?

 

---------- Post added 12-07-2017 at 09:00 ----------

 

 

I don't want to stop her having an opinion, I want her to change her opinion if she really believes all men need to learn how to behave.

Well, we often want to change other peoples opinions, whilst strongly stating our rights to hold our own.

 

If she knows it is only a small minority of men then she shouldn't be publicly blaming all men.

She can do what she likes, you can argue with her, personally I'd just ignore it, her opinion isn't important.

 

You're advocating that it is Ok to treat whole sections of society differently because of the actions of a very small minority within that demographic, you're on a very slippery slope with regards both your moral and legal footing.

 

No, I'm not. I didn't advocate anything other than that this really didn't matter. That's at least the 2nd time you've made claims about what I'm advocating or thinking that aren't reflected in any post here. Either read more closely what I've written, or stop speculating about what I think or have said.

Edited July 12, 2017 by Cyclone

[Andy1976]

Would it? Because swimming pools can run women only sessions, gyms can be women only, so what part of the equality act would stop a private festival being organised that was women only?

 

Quite simply because no one complains and it's done on the basis of there being a 'good reason'. Technically, it's argued that such groups are already at a 'disadvantage' and they try to combat that. I would suggest that there is no disadvantage to being female at a festival, despite what the organiser might suggest.

 

Try creating a white only gym. Colour and gender are both protected characteristics. Let me know how your whites only gym goes won't you. White people are at no disadvantage at gyms, so are offered no protection in the same way.

 

---------- Post added 12-07-2017 at 10:15 ----------

 

She can do what she likes, you can argue with her, personally I'd just ignore it, her opinion isn't important.

 

No, I'm not. I didn't advocate anything other than that this really didn't matter. That's at least the 2nd time you've made claims about what I'm advocating or thinking that aren't reflected in any post here. Either read more closely what I've written, or stop speculating about what I think or have said.

 

Ok, so John The Racist Van Driver is expressing his views on muslims, and wants to start a club that excludes muslims because he believes that they are all terrorists (well, to be clear, he doesn't think all muslims are terrorists, just that all terrorists are muslim) so he wants to be safe.

 

I mean, you can argue with him that he's a racist piece of bigoted filth, or you just ignore him as his opinion isn't important. I mean it's fine that he's starting segregation in events isn't it. That's just his opinion.

[Chelle-82]

A world without men would be really boring so I think that it is a rubbish idea because there will be no men to buy the drinks for all the women

 

100% agree with this!

 

Love how you blokes are arguing about a bunch of women wanting to have a party without men... You do realise from our early years that girls have sleepovers and girly nights without boys because they're smelly and gross!!

 

Similar thing if you think about it, you just get smellier and grosser the older you get

 

Joking aside, men on women, men on men, women on men, women on women etc rape is absolutely abhorrent no matter what the percentages are and if this event is a way for these women to express themselves and get a point across then all power to them.

[Cyclone]

Quite simply because no one complains and it's done on the basis of there being a 'good reason'. Technically, it's argued that such groups are already at a 'disadvantage' and they try to combat that. I would suggest that there is no disadvantage to being female at a festival, despite what the organiser might suggest.

The rape statistics from the cancelled festival she's replacing would suggest that you're talking nonsense though. Unless you think being much more likely to be raped isn't a disadvantage.

 

Ok, so John The Racist Van Driver is expressing his views on muslims, and wants to start a club that excludes muslims because he believes that they are all terrorists (well, to be clear, he doesn't think all muslims are terrorists, just that all terrorists are muslim) so he wants to be safe.

 

I mean, you can argue with him that he's a racist piece of bigoted filth, or you just ignore him as his opinion isn't important. I mean it's fine that he's starting segregation in events isn't it. That's just his opinion.

 

Right. So you want to equate "women are mostly raped by men" with "all terrorists are muslims". Obviously the second statement is untrue, you want to try to make the case that the first one is untrue?

 

It's like you're personally offended that somewhere in the world, there's a festival that you'd never heard of and weren't going to attend, where you've been told you can't attend.

It upsets you, you see this as an attack against men, a group of which you are a member.

You're not concerned about the reasons why, and if a few women have to get raped to ensure that your right to go to this festival you're not planning to go to isn't infringed, then, since you're not a woman, that's a price you're willing for them to pay.

 

That's how it comes across anyway, all these broflakes, moaning about how it's not fair that women might do something and you're not invited. Get over it, she doesn't think you're a rapist, she doesn't know you, but you're still not invited to her festival.

 

---------- Post added 12-07-2017 at 11:00 ----------

 

Quite simply because no one complains and it's done on the basis of there being a 'good reason'. T

 

Oh, and lots of people complain, but it's legal, that's why it happens.

[Andy1976]

What a lot of rubbish that is.

 

But let's go through it.

 

Right. So you want to equate "women are mostly raped by men" with "all terrorists are muslims". Obviously the second statement is untrue, you want to try to make the case that the first one is untrue?

 

Of course they can be equated. They're two statements that are both literally pointless and examples of how this situation is blaming a mass group for the actions of a few.

 

Are all rapists men? No, but most are. Are most rapes against women (the point of the ban apparently)? Yes, most are, but not all.

 

Are all terrorists muslim? Of course not but sadly, at the moment, the majority of the most active groups identify a bastardised version of Islam (albeit they're abusing it).

 

So, yes, I do want to equate the two.

 

And more importantly, are you trying to therefore say that it's ok to bar an entire demographic for the actions of a few, because that's what both examples demonstrate.

 

It's like you're personally offended that somewhere in the world, there's a festival that you'd never heard of and weren't going to attend, where you've been told you can't attend.

 

That's how it comes across anyway, all these broflakes, moaning about how it's not fair that women might do something and you're not invited. Get over it, she doesn't think you're a rapist, she doesn't know you, but you're still not invited to her festival.

 

I'm not offended at all about not being able to attend. I find the fact you're fine with the idea odd to say the least.

 

And 'broflakes'? Seriously, please grow up.

[Cyclone]

So you've accepted that most rapes are by men and against women. Good.

You want to equate that with an entirely erroneous assertion that all terrorists are muslims... Err, okay. Well, the two statements are fundamentally different, in that the first is correct and the second incorrect. They're not equatable.

 

It legally IS okay to bar men from a facility. It legally isn't okay to bar Muslims or any other religion.

 

You're not offended? What are you then, what are we talking about? Do you care in some way? What way? If you don't care, why are you posting about it?

[Andy1976]

So you've accepted that most rapes are by men and against women. Good.

You want to equate that with an entirely erroneous assertion that all terrorists are muslims... Err, okay. Well, the two statements are fundamentally different, in that the first is correct and the second incorrect. They're not equatable.

 

It legally IS okay to bar men from a facility. It legally isn't okay to bar Muslims or any other religion.

 

You're not offended? What are you then, what are we talking about? Do you care in some way? What way? If you don't care, why are you posting about it?

 

Is that what I said? No. No it isn't. At all.

 

I've said that most rapes are committed by men, against women. That's factually correct.

 

I've said that most current terrorist groups are muslim. That's also factually correct - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_designated_terrorist_groups

 

Equally, it's ludicrous to suggest that anything other than a tiny percentage of men are rapists.

 

Equally, it's ludicrous to suggest that anything other than a tiny percentage of muslims are terrorists.

 

I've said it's ridiculous to suggest that it's acceptable to exclude all men from an event on the basis that a small percentage might rape. That is prejudice, and shouldn't be allowed. It is wrong to persecute an entire body of people on the basis of the actions of a few criminals who don't represent that body as a whole.

 

I've said it's ridiculous to suggest that it's acceptable to exclude all muslims from an event on the basis that a small percentage might commit terrorist activities. That is prejudice and shouldn't be allowed. It is wrong to persecute an entire body of people on the basis of the actions of a few criminals who don't represent that body as a whole.

 

Still don't see it? Really? Or just pretending?

 

Feel free to change what I've said again and suggest I've said something I haven't.

 

---------- Post added 12-07-2017 at 11:50 ----------

 

It legally IS okay to bar men from a facility. It legally isn't okay to bar Muslims or any other religion.

 

Oh, and on that point, no, it's not simply legal to bar men. You need reasons and justification. Yes it happens, but it has to be justifiable. It's not simply ok, as sex/gender is a protected characteristic.