Death by dangerous cycling

[redfox]

http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/fact_sheets/dangerous_driving/

 

 

The law changed several years ago now because of the problems caused by trying to encapsulate in law what "reckless" behaviour was - there was a very deep Law Commission paper on the topic. Use of the term reckless in driving cases was replaced as a consequence and has been defined as "dangerous" - see the CPS fact sheet.

 

There are not three types of recklessness in driving - there are three sentencing brackets set by the Sentencing Council.

[ads36]

redfox

 

Not if you actually know what the distinction is - and the definition of dangerous driving is contained in the statute it is not really that hard at all.

 

"the charge of causing death by careless driving can be brought when a driver causes a death because their driving 'fell below the standard expected of a careful and competent driver"

 

"the charge of causing death by dangerous driving can be brought when driving fell far below the standard expected of a careful and competent driver"

 

the difference is down to one word: 'far'

 

it's really very fuzzy.

 

hence the CPS favour prosecuting for 'death by careless driving' because they don't need to 'prove beyond reasonable doubt' that the standard of driving was *far* below that expected.

[redfox]

"the charge of causing death by careless driving can be brought when a driver causes a death because their driving 'fell below the standard expected of a careful and competent driver"

 

"the charge of causing death by dangerous driving can be brought when driving fell far below the standard expected of a careful and competent driver"

 

the difference is down to one word: 'far'

 

it's really very fuzzy.

 

hence the CPS favour prosecuting for 'death by careless driving' because they don't need to 'prove beyond reasonable doubt' that the standard of driving was *far* below that expected.

 

 

 

No - sorry it is not fuzzy at all - and the CPS will not "favour" the lesser of the two offences due to expediency -

Have you any clue how high up the food chain these cases go on review by numerous lawyers before a charge is settled on? There is a specific protocol they operate so decisions are checked and evidence reviewed by more than one person; that is before it is even in a court.

 

You also seem to have overlooked the fact that careless is an alternative for the jury. Maybe your knowledge of such cases is based on long experience ?

[ads36]

yes, you're right. the word 'far' renders the distinction clear as crystal.

 

i see it all now.

[redfox]

yes, you're right. the word 'far' renders the distinction clear as crystal.

 

i see it all now.

 

 

Gosh - what an illuminating post. Try reading up on a topic before you spout and of course having some experience in the area might be of use too.

 

At least you can say you are better informed now.

[Jeffrey Shaw]

Why don't cyclists need any insurance (e.g. third-party only)?

[El Cid]

Why don't cyclists need any insurance (e.g. third-party only)?

 

Because they are similar to pedestrians, in that they don't cause many accidents?

[Bargepole23]

Why don't cyclists need any insurance (e.g. third-party only)?

 

Pedestrians regularly step out in front of me whilst I'm cycling to and from work, most often either riding up Waingate or going through the bus n bike gate near the Howard pub. They're usually looking at the phone or looking the wrong way.

 

I'm willing to bet very few of them have third party insurance.

 

Do you have third party insurance in case you step out in front of a cyclist and cause damage? If not, why not?

[Cyclone]

Why don't cyclists need any insurance (e.g. third-party only)?

 

Why don't walkers, runners, skateboarders, roller skaters, pogo stickers?

 

---------- Post added 29-08-2017 at 22:09 ----------

 

For someone who seems to check facts before they post I think you posted before you checked on this occasion.

 

See link -

 

http://www.road-peace.org.uk/resources/RoadPeace%20Sentencing%20of%20Causing%20Death%20by%20Driving%20offences%20England%20Wales.pdf

 

---------- Post added 29-08-2017 at 12:06 ----------

 

 

 

I wasn't suggesting that the tariff was 'go free'. More that this was the common outcome.

There have been multiple cases of cyclists killed by drivers who were charged with minor offences and walked free with community service.

 

---------- Post added 29-08-2017 at 22:10 ----------

 

Simply untrue.

 

Drivers convicted of death by dangerous driving "generally" go to jail.

 

Read my post again, I didn't say "convicted of DBDD", I said "that kill people". These are two quite different things.

[WalkleyIan]

I believe this trial took place at the same time as the Alliston case. She’s full of remorse though so I guess that is why she’s spared jail.

 

Jessica Wells who killed pensioner in crash is spared jail

 

Jessica Wells, 22, spotted a speed camera as she weaved in and out of traffic and looked down at her dashboard – which showed she was doing 44mph – just moments before hitting Ian Rose.

 

 

Jessica Wells, 22, had overtaken a lorry and undertaken a learner driver in the moments before the fatal crash

 

Vegan chocolate maker Jessica Wells, 22, spotted a speed camera as she weaved in and out of traffic and looked down at her dashboard – which showed she was doing 44mph – in the seconds before she hit 80-year-old Ian Rose.

 

She had overtaken a lorry and undertaken a learner driver just moments before.

 

At that moment Mr Rose was getting off a bus in Eltham Road in Blackheath, south east London before Wells crashed into him.

 

Prosecutor Nicola Merrick said: ‘About 100 metres before the collision she overtook a lorry on her inside and shortly after that she undertook a learner driver on her outside.

 

‘The overtaking manoeuvre took place about 87 or so metres short of the collision with Mr Rose.

 

‘She was travelling somewhere short of 44 miles per hour.

 

‘She noticed a speed camera. It seems that Ms Wells looked at the speed camera and checked her speed.

 

‘That point of distraction was where, sadly, she collided with Mr Rose.’

 

Wells was also injured and took full responsibility for the collision when she was interviewed in hospital, the Old Bailey heard.

 

Mr Rose, who was heading to his home on Raven’s Way when the accident happened at on March last year at around 12:30pm.

 

He lived alone and had no family apart from a nephew in Scotland who had not spoken to him in many years, the court heard.

 

Wells of Swaffham Road, Wendling, Derenham, Norfolk, admitted causing death by careless driving and was today given a sentence of four months imprisonment, suspended for 18 months.

 

The court heard she works as a full-time production assistant for a vegan chocolate company, is a person of ‘impeccable character’ who felt ‘deeply remorseful’ for her actions.

 

‘This knowledge and the guilt of something that she did is a thought she has to live with every day of her life,’ defence counsel Alexandra Tampakopoulos said.

 

Judge Philip Katz QC told Wells: ‘I accept that you have from the word go shown a considerable degree of remorse here.

 

‘It’s quite clear to me you are a sympathetic and compassionate young woman.

 

‘You are also very conscious of the fact you have taken somebody’s life, a fact you will have to live with for the rest of your life.

 

‘I accept wholly that you are thoroughly remorseful about what you have done.

 

‘It seems to me I will cause more damage than justice requires if I sentence you to prison.’

 

---------- Post added 29-08-2017 at 22:54 ----------

 

and another. ..Student driving 60mph in 40mph zone avoids jail after catapulting pedestrian 150 feet in fatal sports car crash

 

http://www.getwestlondon.co.uk/news/west-london-news/student-driving-60mph-40mph-zone-13343068