Its all kicking off in Catalonia

[melthebell]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41463719

 

Well 90% of those who voted and who wernt beaten up voted for independence

[I1L2T3]

I would expect our own Government to behave the same as the Spanish Government, if ever Scotland went down the illegal referendum route.

 

Quick get the troops onto Hadrian's Wall , just in case.

 

Very unlikely

[Car Boot]

The five unelected EU Presidents, who both hate and fear democracy at any level, have been remarkably silent about the human rights violations happening in an EU member state. Masked and armed paramilitary security forces have smashed their way into polling stations and forcibly stolen ballot boxes. Large numbers of people hurt as state forces charged them outside polling stations to prevent them from voting.

 

All with the tacit approval of the wealthy EU bosses, who prefer to look away.

 

The EU is truly an enemy of freedom and democracy.

[I1L2T3]

Well you’ve directed a question at me then answered it yourself, how very bourgeois of you

 

---------- Post added 02-10-2017 at 06:15 ----------

 

 

 

Cohesive ? In what way ?

 

Cohesive in terms of a powerful regional identity, language and culture. That the Spanish police and militia will have just converted into a powerful sense of nationhood

 

---------- Post added 02-10-2017 at 09:11 ----------

 

The five unelected EU Presidents, who both hate and fear democracy at any level, have been remarkably silent about the human rights violations happening in an EU member state. Masked and armed paramilitary security forces have smashed their way into polling stations and forcibly stolen ballot boxes. Large numbers of people hurt as state forces charged them outside polling stations to prevent them from voting.

 

All with the tacit approval of the wealthy EU bosses, who prefer to look away.

 

The EU is truly an enemy of freedom and democracy.

 

Let's see how they respond. This could be manna from heaven for Brexiteers.

 

Depending on the response from the core I might start feeling a bit Brexity again myself.

 

One thing for certain: any negotiation over Gibraltar has just been killed off.

[melthebell]

The five unelected EU Presidents, who both hate and fear democracy at any level, have been remarkably silent about the human rights violations happening in an EU member state. Masked and armed paramilitary security forces have smashed their way into polling stations and forcibly stolen ballot boxes. Large numbers of people hurt as state forces charged them outside polling stations to prevent them from voting.

 

All with the tacit approval of the wealthy EU bosses, who prefer to look away.

 

The EU is truly an enemy of freedom and democracy.

 

Hahaha well done for managing to link the two

[Puggie]

The five unelected EU Presidents, who both hate and fear democracy at any level, have been remarkably silent about the human rights violations happening in an EU member state.

 

The EU holds democracy in contempt but only when the result doesn't advance their political agenda. You only need to look at how the EU tried to punish the French when they voted against the Constitution of Europe, or when the Irish voted against the Lisbon Treaty, or when the Greeks voted against austerity.

 

So of course when Britain voted to leave the European Union there was talk of punishment within Brussels and Berlin which absolutely didn't go down well with No 10, so unfortunately we had to start showing our teeth.

[L00b]

You only need to look at how the EU tried to punish the French when they voted against the Constitution of Europe, or when the Irish voted against the Lisbon Treaty, or when the Greeks voted against austerity.

Go on, I'll bite: how did the EU try to "punish them"?

So of course when Britain voted to leave the European Union there was talk of punishment within Brussels and Berlin which absolutely didn't go down well with No 10, so unfortunately we had to start showing our teeth.

Same again, about that "talk of punishment within Brussels and Berlin"?

 

The EU's position about the Catalunya referendum has been crystal clear, consistently so. It's a domestic constitutional matter, internal to Spain, nowt to do with the EU, period. No different to the 2014 Scottish referendum, which the EU likewise kept well out of.

 

Kudos to you (and the other EU-bashers) for the red top-style baseless heckling, though

 

The Spanish Government would have been far better letting this run and then discussing the outcome with the Catalonians afterwards.

 

The Spanish Government have painted themselves into a corner by using force immediately, going in with batons and rubber bullets: anyone they arrest and imprison is a martyr, security forces on the streets of Catalonia are oppressors denying democracy, and there's every chance that some of the 10% who voted against independence will react badly to being told that they're not entitled to have a voice.

 

Catalonian independence is now basically a foregone conclusion, whether it happens next week or in a decade.

Edited October 2, 2017 by L00b

[Car Boot]

The EU's position about the Catalunya referendum has been crystal clear, consistently so. It's a domestic constitutional matter, internal to Spain, nowt to do with the EU, period. No different to the 2014 Scottish referendum, which the EU likewise kept well out of.

 

The EU has no interest in defending the fundamental human rights of EU citizens. It's muted response to what has happened, and is still happening in Spain, demonstrates this.

 

Yet the EU will criticise non-EU countries for human rights abuses, such as Turkey and various African states.

 

---------- Post added 02-10-2017 at 14:04 ----------

 

Catalonia has shown us the true face of centralised EU policing.

 

Smash the EU - by any means necessary.

[L00b]

The EU has no interest in defending the fundamental human rights of EU citizens. It's muted response to what has happened, and is still happening in Spain, demonstrates this.

Ah, so when the EU respects the sovereignty of its members by refraining from meddling in internal constitutional matters, and so doesn't leap to the defence of independence-seeking Catalunyans, it is because of its allegiance to Big Capitalist masters?

 

But when it improves workers' rights time and again, uniformly across the European jurisdiction, by imposing corresponding legislative updates on its members, it is because of...what? its allegiance to Big Capitalist masters?

Yet the EU will criticise non-EU countries for human rights abuses, such as Turkey and various African states.

When you post a strawman argument, you don't do things by half, do you?

 

I wish this forum did IMG tags so I could post a Do Equis man ("I don't always") meme

Catalonia has shown us the true face of centralised EU policing.

Today must be a good day for revelations: your posts have shown the true face of your socio-economic illiteracy

[tzijlstra]

I must have missed that referendum. Was that illegal too?

 

A referendum on the topic might well be on the cards, it is just that it would be a waste of money as only 13% of the Spanish support leaving the EU regarding a recent poll. Turns out people aren't against democracy, they are pro-EU...

 

Absolutely disgusting. A total embarrassment to the EU.

 

It is absolutely nothing to do with the EU. Let's say that the UK government send national police forces up to Glasgow and Edinburgh to smash up voting stations in a Scottish independence referendum? Would that be the fault of the EU?

 

People like you and Car Boot are so completely and utterly unaware of the jurisdiction of the EU that you simply should go sit in a corner, be quiet and contemplate what you are actually against here.

 

Car Boot taking the ultimate biscuit by claiming the EU is the capitalist influence in the UK. Hilarious. Socialists like him just voted for the government to flush everything down the kitchen sink and go full-on one hundred percent capitalist and still manages to ignore that fact and blame the organisation that has done more for workers' rights, consumer protection and democracy than the UK's government has ever achieved.