Why does the Council feel the need to enforce bus lanes on Xmas Day?

[diezeltruck]

Planner1

 

I shall respond to your further comments, but not now, as I am a little busy. You make some interesting comments.

 

I shall respond hopefully tomorrow, as I have many answers to the points you have made.

 

I am quite well versed on the subject of bus lanes.

 

You are certainly not the only one here to come across as that.

 

Because YOU say so, does not mean it is correct.

[choogling]

we are all equal but bus and taxi passengers are some how more deserving of a quick journey than other road users. I don't think so.

[cgksheff]

Some towns do not grant bus lane privileges to taxis.

 

Personally, I don't think they should.

If any vehicle other than buses should have access, it should be any vehicle with 4 or more occupants.

[Dannyno]

I'm glad somebody has pointed out that bus lines aren't just for buses, but for taxis, cyclists and some other vehicles as well.

 

I'd be in favour of relaxing restrictions when traffic is light - except that in terms of signage you need to keep wording plain and simple. I wouldn't mind if Councils decided to waive fines, except I'd be worried about motorists second guessing the rules.

 

There are FOI requests about the number of PCNs issued in Sheffield on Christmas day.

 

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/bustram_lanegate_pcn_statistics

 

This reveals that on 25/12/2015, 8 PCNs were issued in relation to bus/tram lane/gate restrictions. 4 for Langsett Road and 4 for Middlewood Road.

 

And on 25/12/2016, 7 PCNs were issued, all of them for the London Road bus gate.

 

I'm wondering if David Blythen is our own diezeltruck? If so, then the reason for the interest is clear - his brother was penalised for using the Mansfield Road bus lane on a bank holiday Monday.

 

https://www.thestar.co.uk/our-towns-and-cities/sheffield/hundreds-more-bus-lane-fines-issued-on-bank-holidays-in-sheffield-1-8641540

 

---------- Post added 28-12-2017 at 22:11 ----------

 

And we know from another of Blythen's FOI requests...

 

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/sheffield_bustram_lanesgates_pen

 

.. that an average 2016/17 Monday PCN haul was 174. And the average on a bank holiday Monday in 2016/17 was 230. Note that the average for Mondays excludes the bank holiday Mondays. It's actually the average for Mondays except for those particular ones.

 

---------- Post added 28-12-2017 at 22:41 ----------

 

Liverpool decided to temporarily suspend bus lanes a few years ago and it was such a success that they have not reintroduced them.

I find the biggest hindrance to keeping moving is inconsiderate parking.

 

Not true, they reinstated a handful.

 

On other routes they were recommended to introduce other measures. The consultants report noted a 1-1.5% increase in both bus and other traffic journey times while the suspensions were in effect. Worth comparing their draft report with the report that was officially and initially released.

 

I think it's a good idea to test these things out - it might turn out that some of Sheffield's routes aren't in the right place or have little effect. But I'm not ideologically opposed to bus routes.

 

---------- Post added 28-12-2017 at 22:49 ----------

 

No, but I am planning to do.

 

With an average of 26 contraventions issued with a PCN for a normal working day Monday, simple mathematics conclude that is 5.7 vehicles per hour of bus lane restrictions at Moore St. (Almost one every 10 minutes)

<snip>

 

The trouble with your "simple mathematics" is that all you've done here is average out the 26 PCNs across the restricted period. But who says that contraventions are equally likely across all hours of that period? Might there not be particular times where more people contravene the restrictions than others?

 

---------- Post added 28-12-2017 at 22:51 ----------

 

we are all equal but bus and taxi passengers are some how more deserving of a quick journey than other road users. I don't think so.

 

But there's a wider social question, isn't there? Might it not be a legitimate social aim to encourage people to use public transport, in order to try to reduce car use, on the grounds that otherwise gridlock and pollution are exacerbated and journey times increased?

Edited December 28, 2017 by Dannyno

[Cyclone]

As you are well aware from previous posts, overall highway capacity is largely governed by junction capacity. Bus lanes generally end before the junction so don't affect network capacity.

 

In light traffic conditions, motorists will gain no advantage by using the bus lane.

Yes, I agree, but equally there is no reason to be enforcing the lanes.

 

---------- Post added 29-12-2017 at 10:05 ----------

 

we are all equal but bus and taxi passengers are some how more deserving of a quick journey than other road users. I don't think so.

 

Multi occupancy vehicles are given a benefit to encourage there use.

I'm not sure why that includes taxi's though, as not counting the driver they are often single occupancy.

[Rob Parsons]

It’s patently obviously why the road system is in such disarray having read some of planner1’s comments!!

 

Yeah..his comment.".If the bus lane stops before the junction and all traffic can use all lanes, how does it cause traffic congestion? How quickly traffic can flow over the stop line at the junction is what determines junction capacity and whether there will be a queue." Shows how little he knows.

[onewheeldave]

On the subject of taxis using bus lanes. I'm hearing from a lot of drivers that many are now going home during rush hour, as it is not economically viable to work when the traffic is moving as slow as it does during those times. Taxi drivers get paid by the mile, so, clearly, if traffic is virtually at a standstill, their earnings can drop below the level necessary to cover their business expenses (fuel, radio, taxes, maintenance etc).

 

So I'd say that is a good reason why taxis should be allowed to use bus lanes- it encourages them to continue working during rush hours.

 

Additionally, a lot of disabled people use taxis- they will be severely affected if numbers diminish.

 

And of course, a lot of hospital users, including large numbers of dialysis patients, use taxis- for those, it is critical that they aren't held up in static traffic.

[cgksheff]

On the subject of taxis using bus lanes. I'm hearing from a lot of drivers that many are now going home during rush hour, as it is not economically viable to work when the traffic is moving as slow as it does during those times. Taxi drivers get paid by the mile, so, clearly, if traffic is virtually at a standstill, their earnings can drop below the level necessary to cover their business expenses (fuel, radio, taxes, maintenance etc).

 

So I'd say that is a good reason why taxis should be allowed to use bus lanes- it encourages them to continue working during rush hours.

 

Additionally, a lot of disabled people use taxis- they will be severely affected if numbers diminish.

 

And of course, a lot of hospital users, including large numbers of dialysis patients, use taxis- for those, it is critical that they aren't held up in static traffic.

 

I've never been unable to get a taxi in the rush hours.

 

Hackney meters apply a waiting charge when stationary or travelling slower than 8mph.

 

There is no justification for subsidising one sector's income over another's. My time is as valuable as any taxi driver's.

 

If you have an appointment that involves travelling during rush hour, set off earlier.

Edited December 29, 2017 by cgksheff

[onewheeldave]

I've never been unable to get a taxi in the rush hours.

Lucky you. I've often been unable to get one in rush hour

Hackney meters apply a waiting charge when stationary or travelling slower than 8mph.

and City cabs don't.

There is no justification for subsidising one sector's income over another's. My time is as valuable as any taxi driver's.

'Subsidising', I would say, is not the right word. I was talking about taxi's being allowed to use bus lanes, and gave several good justifications for that.

[Waister]

 

SYPTE are doing a review of the existing bus lanes to see if they are still needed.

 

 

So the people whos job it is to promote buses over cars are reviewing the need to keep bus lanes.........

Think I know how this will end up..........