£11 for 15 minutes of Care..

[truman]

The 'pig' has been travelling through the python for nearly 70 years, (and paying its way..) Hardly a surprise it was going to pop out the other end. Where was the forward planning?

 

Maybe we should restrict the NHS to the things it was doing 70 years ago...let's forget all the advances which help people live longer than ever..

[Obelix]

The 'pig' has been travelling through the python for nearly 70 years, (and paying its way, we were the ones paying 30% tax.) Hardly a surprise it was going to pop out the other end. Where was the forward planning?

 

The monies paid in were never to build up a fund to pay in future. This is a common mistake - the monies paid were to fund the then current requirement, on the understanding that when you got older the new working generation would be paying for you.

 

However life expectancy skyrocketed and so did the cost of care - no one could foresee the developments in care that meant life expectance at retirement went from say six years to twenty or more...

[truman]

The 'pig' has been travelling through the python for nearly 70 years, (and paying its way, we were the ones paying 30% tax.) Hardly a surprise it was going to pop out the other end. Where was the forward planning?

 

You keep saying people were on poor wages so it was 30% of not very much though Anna.

[Robin-H]

It was much better in the 70s than now actually.

 

Lots of day care centres, and provision for the disabled in those days. Remploy centres etc. for the vulnerable who wanted to work, the old Asylums were being modernised and redeveloped (I worked in Middlewood Hospital briefly in the early 70s) or closed down completely to be replaced with 'care in the community' which was well funded and worked. It wasn't just words. Another friend of mine worked as a house mother, in one of the small specialised houses for 4 individual people, staffed round the clock, and meant to be a home from home for the residents, and was.

 

Most of the day care centres are now closed, Remploy is gone, and 'care in the community' is just a joke, so all those people are now left to fend for themsellves and cannot cope.

 

I admit the legislation for things like 'access' weren't in place, nor the employment legislation as far as I know, but that is widely ignored these days, or got round, and exists in name only. The Conservatives have cut back every aspect of social care so we are now one of the worst in the Europe.

 

A case of rose tinted glasses I think..

[Obelix]

Indeed.

 

Here is that fantastically good NHS service in the mid 1970's... (World in ACtion - the Blood n Guts shift)

 

 

Just look at the amazing equipment and all the staff there is to treat people.... The wages that the doctor was on were truly astonishing too!

 

Please note this clip shows unlicenced hairstyles that may infringe on your sense of Bad Taste

[Anna B]

Indeed.

 

Here is that fantastically good NHS service in the mid 1970's... (World in ACtion - the Blood n Guts shift)

 

 

Just look at the amazing equipment and all the staff there is to treat people.... The wages that the doctor was on were truly astonishing too!

 

Please note this clip shows unlicenced hairstyles that may infringe on your sense of Bad Taste

 

Hairstyles apart, I've seen many a documentary on the modern day health service, and they're none too flattering.

 

---------- Post added 06-03-2018 at 18:23 ----------

 

A case of rose tinted glasses I think..

 

Not at all. Were you there, and old enough to notice?

[Robin-H]

Hairstyles apart, I've seen many a documentary on the modern day health service, and they're none too flattering.

 

---------- Post added 06-03-2018 at 18:23 ----------

 

 

Not at all. Were you there, and old enough to notice?

 

We don't need to rely on personal experience to determine whether or not the government offered more support for disabled people in the 1970s than today.

 

Somebody might have had wonderful support and assistance and thought everything was all rosy. Someone else might have had an absolutely torrid time and is thankful those days are behind us. Personal experience, or memories of personal experience, do little to actually reveal how things were.

 

Instead, we can look at the facts and figures, such as how much financial support was offered to disabled people then compared to now. We can look at things such as life expectancy. We can look at policy. We can look at how difficult life was for disabled people in terms of access to building and infrastructure, discrimination in the work place etc etc.

[truman]

Hairstyles apart, I've seen many a documentary on the modern day health service, and they're none too flattering.

 

---------- Post added 06-03-2018 at 18:23 ----------

 

 

Not at all. Were you there, and old enough to notice?

 

Yes I was...things are far better now than ever they were...

[Anna B]

We don't need to rely on personal experience to determine whether or not the government offered more support for disabled people in the 1970s than today.

 

Somebody might have had wonderful support and assistance and thought everything was all rosy. Someone else might have had an absolutely torrid time and is thankful those days are behind us. Personal experience, or memories of personal experience, do little to actually reveal how things were.

 

Instead, we can look at the facts and figures, such as how much financial support was offered to disabled people then compared to now. We can look at things such as life expectancy. We can look at policy. We can look at how difficult life was for disabled people in terms of access to building and infrastructure, discrimination in the work place etc etc.

 

So you weren't there... so you don't really know do you?

 

Measure all you like, one of the things you can't quantify is peace of mind. And that makes all the difference. Life these days has turned into a lottery. People are frightened for the future.

 

You hoped you wouldn't need it but in the past if the worst happened you always knew help was at hand and you would be taken care of, and that made all the difference.

 

Nowadays, be unlucky enough to get Dementia, you are going to lose all your savings and your home. Can't afford to buy a house? Say goodbye to security, you are at the mercy of a Landlord. Need an operation? Well that depends on which Health Authority you come under and whether or not you qualify. Need help? Go whistle for it, it's no longer there unless you can afford to pay for it.

 

And believe it or not, because the help was freely there, people were more self reliant. They took pride in not needing help and standing on their own two feet.

That changed in the 80s. A mixture of unemployment, inequality and bitterness meant that they grabbed what they could get off the government, who (after 3 terms of Toryism and Margaret Thatcher,) they felt had betrayed them. That divide still exists today with people more polarised than ever.

[Robin-H]

So you weren't there... so you don't really know do you?

 

Measure all you like, one of the things you can't quantify is peace of mind. And that makes all the difference. Life these days has turned into a lottery. People are frightened for the future.

 

You hoped you wouldn't need it but in the past if the worst happened you always knew help was at hand and you would be taken care of, and that made all the difference.

 

Nowadays, be unlucky enough to get Dementia, you are going to lose all your savings and your home. Can't afford to buy a house? Say goodbye to security, you are at the mercy of a Landlord. Need an operation? Well that depends on which Health Authority you come under and whether or not you qualify. Need help? Go whistle for it, it's no longer there unless you can afford to pay for it.

 

And believe it or not, because the help was freely there, people were more self reliant. They took pride in not needing help and standing on their own two feet.

That changed in the 80s. A mixture of unemployment, inequality and bitterness meant that they grabbed what they could get off the government, who (after 3 terms of Toryism and Margaret Thatcher,) they felt had betrayed them. That divide still exists today with people more polarised than ever.

 

I didn't say I wasn't there. I said it is entirely irrelevant whether I was there or not.

 

Truman says they were there, and says things are far better now than they ever were. You presumably don't believe that, so why should I believe you? You see why personal anecdotes don't help?

 

Luckily, we have all the things I mentioned in my previous post to assess whether or not things were better then or not. Perhaps you should look into some of them.

 

You could start by reading this

 

http://eprints.lse.ac.uk/6490/1/The_Evolution_of_Disability_Benefits_in_the_UK_Re-weighting_the_basket.pdf

 

---------- Post added 06-03-2018 at 21:26 ----------

 

So you weren't there... so you don't really know do you?

 

Measure all you like, one of the things you can't quantify is peace of mind. And that makes all the difference. Life these days has turned into a lottery. People are frightened for the future.

 

You hoped you wouldn't need it but in the past if the worst happened you always knew help was at hand and you would be taken care of, and that made all the difference.

 

Nowadays, be unlucky enough to get Dementia, you are going to lose all your savings and your home. Can't afford to buy a house? Say goodbye to security, you are at the mercy of a Landlord. Need an operation? Well that depends on which Health Authority you come under and whether or not you qualify. Need help? Go whistle for it, it's no longer there unless you can afford to pay for it.

 

And believe it or not, because the help was freely there, people were more self reliant. They took pride in not needing help and standing on their own two feet.

That changed in the 80s. A mixture of unemployment, inequality and bitterness meant that they grabbed what they could get off the government, who (after 3 terms of Toryism and Margaret Thatcher,) they felt had betrayed them. That divide still exists today with people more polarised than ever.

 

That is simply not true.