The Consequences of Brexit [part 5] Read 1st post before posting

[woodview]

I’m aware -and tolerant, would you believe- of divergent opinions, and am not trying to trick you either: I’m just logic-testing your own argument, to see whether it is borne from pragmatism (worth debating SFAIC) or from nationalism (worth ignoring, again SFAIC).

OK. I prefer regional autonomy, whether that requires breaking away from the UK, is debateable, that can only be decided by the region in question.

In terms of the EU, we chose to break away, the reason would have been very diverse, ranging from the sensible to the extreme, and logical to the wrong. Same as the the divergent reasons people wanted to stay.

[mafya]

Final brexit deal could be reached by next Wednesday- The EU blocs chief negotiator says = https://news.sky.com/story/final-brexit-divorce-deal-could-be-reached-by-next-wednesday-eu-11522903

[tinfoilhat]

Final brexit deal could be reached by next Wednesday- The EU blocs chief negotiator says = https://news.sky.com/story/final-brexit-divorce-deal-could-be-reached-by-next-wednesday-eu-11522903

 

But it also looks like the DUP will start throwing spanners in the works if they don't like it.

 

DUP 'could vote against the Budget' over Brexit deal - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45806063

[woodview]

But it also looks like the DUP will start throwing spanners in the works if they don't like it.

 

DUP 'could vote against the Budget' over Brexit deal - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45806063

 

There's not much detail in any of the stories regarding what the actual deal proposal is, but if the DUP are kicking off about having to barscan all cows, instead of 10% in the sea crossing, then it's a sad indication of the entrenched mentality that is unfortunately so common in NI politics.

[I1L2T3]

I agree with your first points. They can't represent all their consitiuents because we don't have PR. As you say, many have other jobs, and many are career politicians. It needs a shake up.

 

But the same can be said for MEPs.

I'm not saying our parliament is perfect, far from it. I dispair of it a lot of the time. However, it is closer under our influence than the european parliament.

I simply don't like the dilution that it brings.

 

I’m not suggesting they can ever actively represent all their constituents.

 

But they can in certain policy areas actively work against the interests of the majority of their constituents. The MP in thrall to lobbyists who are working to accelerate the privatisation of the NHS as an example.

 

Corporate influence overriding constituents’ interests

[woodview]

I’m not suggesting they can ever actively represent all their constituents.

 

But they can in certain policy areas actively work against the interests of the majority of their constituents. The MP in thrall to lobbyists who are working to accelerate the privatisation of the NHS as an example.

Sure. But how is that different in UK politics and EU politics? The cronyism needs to stop whether it be there or here.

[I1L2T3]

Because, by your own words, you favour further regionalisation over further centralisation.

 

We can also -or alternatively- consider your sovereignty argument under the light of the government-acquired emergency legislating powers. For instance.

 

If required, primer in simple enough terms in this very interesting article.

 

The Tories (this crop anyway) have very powerful centralising instincts.

[woodview]

The Tories (this crop anyway) have very powerful centralising instincts.

Perhaps so. Corbyn has claimed to support regionalised power in the past, not sure where that sits now.

[I1L2T3]

Sure. But how is that different in UK politics and EU politics? The cronyism needs to stop whether it be there or here.

 

Yes it’s similar in the EU. The difference is you have 28 countries to mitigate the extreme consequences of corporate lobbying. It’s quite powerful in that respect.

 

Leaving the EU does not stop it here. It removes safeguards against corporate influence. If you follow that thread you will see (partly) why ‘pure capitalism’ ideologues are agitating for Brexit

 

---------- Post added 10-10-2018 at 19:11 ----------

 

Perhaps so. Corbyn has claimed to support regionalised power in the past, not sure where that sits now.

 

I think he and Momentum seem very controlling with centralising instincts as well. The activity to deselect MPs will not be dynamically springing up from grass roots on its own. It will be dictated from the centre to reshape the Labour Party.

 

I hate Labour and the Tories right now. With a passion.

[andyofborg]

But it also looks like the DUP will start throwing spanners in the works if they don't like it.

 

DUP 'could vote against the Budget' over Brexit deal - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45806063

 

when it comes to it then i doubt they will, budgets are traditionally seen as a confidence matter should they vote the budget down and the prime minister follow tradition then the government collapses.

 

it's doubtful that the current leader of the conservative party would be in a position to try and form a new government and so there would be several weeks while the conservative party tore itself apart choosing a new leader who, in turn, would struggle to form a government.

 

the end result would be either the leader of the opposition trying to form a new government or, more likely, the dissolution of the current parliament and a general election which might result in the current leader of the opposition just crossing the line and becoming the prime minister, something the DUP seem to view with horror. the alternative would be a conservative government who would have no choice but to try and get the previously rejected budget through since the alternative would essentially make them hostages of the DUP.

 

either way the end result would be a mess and at a critical time in the negotiations regarding ending our current relationship with the eu and negotiating a new one.