The Consequences of Brexit [part 5] Read 1st post before posting

[apelike]

I wouldn't hold you're breath with that just yet.

 

I think the likelihood of having another referendum is almost non existent. May would need to ask the EU if it is possible to revoke revoke A50 which would have many legal implications in the EU and UK. Then if at all possible it would need the approval of all 27 members but if only one member vetoes it then its an non starter. May would need to; get her government to agree to request that A50 is revoked, she then would need to get the EU to agree, she would then need to get her government to approve a new referendum, and parliament would need to vote on it. They then would need to draft legislation to hold another, pass an act and agree when it would be held. That would all need to happen before our time is up!

 

However, if and that is a big IF one is called for and approved then I would accept it.

 

---------- Post added 27-10-2018 at 00:18 ----------

 

So...

In the Poll Tax march, 200,000 protested and the government changed the policy...

 

A policy which her own government and parliament were not happy with which helped her to get outed and put that lukewarm John Major in place. If she had stayed in power it would have been water cannons out on the streets, people locked up and we would still have the poll-tax. Major just did what was necessary to keep the Conservatives in power that's all. Its all about politics you see, it has nothing to do with ordinary people at all.

 

In the Remain march an estimated 700,000 marched for a second referendum (yes, a pro-Brexit march got 1,200 at the same time) and the Government ignores them.

 

Maybe that's because the referendum had already been voted on and accepted by parliament, unlike the pool tax which was just government policy and changeable.

 

Is this the government reflecting democracy in action? Or is it the government bowing to the anti-democratic shouting of the pro-leave campaign?

 

Its reflecting the actions of a democratic process and decision. I doubt it can be the latter as you have already stated only 1,200 attended a pro-brexit march. In any-case why shout when you have already won.

[tzijlstra]

Wrong apelike, the EU would embrace a second referendum and support it. It has repeatedly said as much.

[I1L2T3]

Ape like, you talk about the referendum as if it was the culmination of the democratic process.

 

That is dangerous and wrong. The democratic process did not stop in 2016. Our relationship with the EU will be continuously influenced by the democratic process

 

To suggest it can’t be seems really odd.

 

After all, if the more extreme Brexiters for example don’t get the Brexit they want, they will expect to use the democratic process to change that.

 

A challenge to the form of Brexit is not a challenge to the democratic process.

[Lockdoctor]

Wrong apelike, the EU would embrace a second referendum and support it. It has repeatedly said as much.

Yes the EU will embrace anything they hope will get the UK to stay in the EU, given the fact the UK is one of the largest contributors to the EU budget and the EU have a massive trade surplus with the UK. The EU know they are more likely to have a long term future with the UK being a member than the UK not being a member.

[melthebell]

If that was the case they'd be falling over themselves to agree anything we put forward instead of protecting the whole other 27?

[The Joker]

Yes the EU will embrace anything they hope will get the UK to stay in the EU, given the fact the UK is one of the largest contributors to the EU budget and the EU have a massive trade surplus with the UK. The EU know they are more likely to have a long term future with the UK being a member than the UK not being a member.

 

makes me democratically wonder why you democratically said you democratically voted to democratically remain in the EU in the democratic first democratic place

[Lockdoctor]

If that was the case they'd be falling over themselves to agree anything we put forward instead of protecting the whole other 27?

They are falling over themselves to make it difficult and awkward for an existing member to leave in order to keep the remaining 27 in line.

[I1L2T3]

They are falling over themselves to make it difficult and awkward for an existing member to leave in order to keep the remaining 27 in line.

 

That’s not true is it.

 

They have been straight about the parameters from day one. We knew what their position was from the start.

 

The only way they have wavered from that is to try and accommodate some of Mays requests to help her get a deal.

[Car Boot]

Wait a minute - parliament decided to let us have a vote because the populous wanted a vote... You got a vote. They decided to act on that vote, even though there was no legal obligation to do so.

 

Now the populous want another vote, but we can't have that one because you are scared they might change their minds - that's not democracy.

 

Polling shows that Remain and Leave are very close together in the opinion polls. What did polling show about Remain before the June 2016 People's Vote?

 

Leave would have a very effective campaigning message in the event of another referendum. This would be the Establishment/Politicians/Big Business/Celebrities/Luvvies/the Rich telling people they got it wrong and so must vote again. This would motivate large numbers of people to vote. Do not underestimate the anger this would generate.

 

A significant proportion of non-fanatical Remain voters would question why they were having another vote? They may abstain or vote Leave for democratic reasons.

 

The real factors that drove Brexit - a desire for change, a belief that the EU is for the benefit of Big Business and the Rich, a desire for an end to austerity and a deep anti-establishment resentment haven't gone away. The causes behind the vote haven't been tackled and remain the same, perhaps even stronger than in 2016.

 

People shouldn't necessarily expect the vote to be different, particularly when the Remain camp still seems only capable of focusing on the supposed negative consequences of Brexit - rather than any positive consequences of being in the EU.

[Magilla]

They are falling over themselves to make it difficult and awkward for an existing member to leave in order to keep the remaining 27 in line.

 

Simply laughable, couldn't be further from reality.

 

In other news:

 

Looks like over 20 nations have objected to the UK quotas under WTO, so thats another couple of dozen deals that need to be done before we can even join the WTO without penalties. Wonder how long they're going to take?

 

Credit ratings agencies are looking to reduce the UK's credit rating downward again, already dropped from AAA+ to AA-, the cost of borrowing for the UK is set to rise again.

 

We're now going to be needing wartime levels of taxation to even remotely balance to books going forward or we're stuck with more austerity for a generation at least.

 

---------- Post added 27-10-2018 at 09:52 ----------

 

That’s not true is it.

 

They have been straight about the parameters from day one. We knew what their position was from the start.

 

The only way they have wavered from that is to try and accommodate some of Mays requests to help her get a deal.

 

Indeed, the reality is that the EU have bent over backwards to accomodate, just as they did during our membership, but they won't offer "all the benefits with none of the responsibilities" as per Brexiteers promises.

Edited October 27, 2018 by Magilla