Why has religion retained its appeal?

[RootsBooster]

Unless I missed it, you still haven't provided an answer, yet you have continued to talk about the above (excessively). It appears that you are going to great lengths to dance around the subject, can you not just state (briefly and clearly) what you think consciousness, awareness and the mind are?

At the very least, please give your definition of consciousness (as that's the thing you've been talking most about)

Sorry, I have had to answer many questions.

 

Consciousness in its purity is what and who we are seeing, witnessing ourselves and everything inside and outside this. This consciousness is aware of our body, it is aware of our thoughts. It sees all of this happening, in order to be fully aware of this consciousness this can only happen when it is clear. If there are any clouds, thoughts ideas or other distracting things happening this consciousness is not fully seen or experienced.

When you see this consciousness clearly with no thoughts that doesn't mean you don't have a brain anymore, the brain is still there to speak, write, and sort problems.

The difference is that your consciousness can also see the mind but your mind cannot see your consciousness. That's why I sound like a weirdo to you.

 

Awareness is the process of becoming aware of your consciousness. Your mind is very useful but it is not who or what you are and it cant see any further than its own dimensions. Awareness is also the capacity to witness and watch everything consciously instead of unconsciously. A reaction from the brain is often unconscious, something happens, the reaction comes as a standard unaware standard response. Someone says hello to you, you don't think but automatically say hello back. When you are aware you don't respond automatic and instead look clearly and answer free from any reactions. The more aware you are, consciousness is seen and experienced and mind relaxes, mind is still there but only when you need it.

 

Mind is our thoughts, ideas, thinking. Mind will think about something and find solutions or ways to react when certain things happen.

Mind can only work like a biocomputer it can control our emotions body thoughts, culture, language. It has a lot of say over these things.

Many people here have said that they are their mind. The issue is that when this mind says it is who you are you become blind to your own consciousness. The mind says, I am who I am and your possibility of becoming aware of your consciousness has been closed.

Mind is not who you are, it is there, you can see it, your mind can influence your emotions but again your consciousness when fully aware witnesses all of this realising and seeing the confusion. And when you do see it, it does look silly because not many people bother with looking further than their minds and believe that is all they are. Mind is very intelligent but it cant see any further or beyond itself and will never ever know what consciousness is.

 

There is no way religion will ever lose its appeal. This process of people locked in their minds wanting to become aware and conscious is there.

This is an individual process and no church can do that for you. But there is a lot to be learned when becoming aware of ones consciousness. One of those things is that mind is not the master, it is only a slave and consciousness is what you really are.

 

Okay, no could you define what you think the words "clearly" and "briefly" mean?

On second thoughts, leave it.

 

Assuming, for a moment, that your post made sense, how have you come about this knowledge? What makes you think that any of it is anything more than just the effects of brain chemistry at work?

 

---------- Post added 06-08-2018 at 10:31 ----------

 

When I started about real religious knowledge on this “why has religion kept its appeal topic” I knew this would get a lot of reactions from people who have become stuck identified with their unconscious minds. With real religious knowledge I didn’t mean believing in some holy scriptures but the process of stopping all believes. Science has been good at reducing the old organised religions. The holy scriptures are not something to believe in. Is there any meaning in these scriptures? Yes and no, but these scriptures are absolutely useless when someone doesn’t understand their meaning. Some of them try to explain something meaningful our unconscious minds cannot understand. Any believe in anything is meaningless, including the believe that you are your mind.

 

Science looks at logical facts, that is fine and better than believing but still stays in that same mind. Your mind can believe in bible or be a logical scientist, either way this happens in this same mind and will stay at that level of inability to become aware of your consciousness.

Only humans identify with their thoughts. That is why humans are so obsessed with science and religion, no animal will start a scientific experiment or look for their ultimate source of awareness.

 

There are ways, techniques, to slow and silence the mind creating silent empty gaps that eventually reveal where your true natural centre is, how it connects with the universe and shows full understanding of your body mind and its death. Some scientist are trying to look for non physical emptiness but will only see that it cannot be measured, calculated, explained. The non physical centre of existence cannot be controlled, altered or manipulated by scientists.

So what is this emptiness, our unconscious minds cannot connect with. This borderless non physical hollow emptiness can be witnessed, not while thinking about it, but in total silence watching, experiencing. This eternal non physical emptiness is the very centre of everything. Physical matter is not the central main aspect, everything material will grow, deplete, live or die one day.

Try to think about it and you wont get it. Meditate, see, watch and witness, the mind calms down, things clear up, and if you become aware of your consciousness. This borderless emptiness that is actually the very centre of what and who you are can become visible. It doesn’t conflict with science, a scientist fully aware of their consciousness would see that material matter is only something temporary continuously changing form within an eternal hollow borderless emptiness.

 

I think ambiguity should be banned from the forum.

[dutch]

Okay, no could you define what you think the words "clearly" and "briefly" mean?

On second thoughts, leave it.

 

Assuming, for a moment, that your post made sense, how have you come about this knowledge? What makes you think that any of it is anything more than just the effects of brain chemistry at work?

 

---------- Post added 06-08-2018 at 10:31 ----------

 

 

I think ambiguity should be banned from the forum.

 

This topic is supposed to be about religion. You never heard of tao, or zen. Don't worry I will not spend my time trying to explain this in the Sheffield section.

 

Most people who have discovered what I have tried to explain here have been told to get lost by people who aren't interested and prefer to remain identified with their mind. I am not supprised same thing happens here. Very few people take the courage to actually see what happens when becoming aware of their actual consciousness again.

 

---------- Post added 06-08-2018 at 14:29 ----------

 

It will make sense when you see it. Thinking about it won't work. My knowledge has come through meditation when not controlled by any thoughts. It shows what is real and what's the dream. It needs complete silence of the brain. You are still there watching seeing this, it shows everything in its purest form.

Edited August 6, 2018 by dutch

[Cyclone]

You don't try to explain, you just make claims that it can't be explained and that the only way to know is to experience. Very much like religious revelations.

 

You did it in that very post in fact. "It will all make sense when you see". You can't explain, there is nothing to explain.

[RootsBooster]

Cyclone is right, you talk like any one of the thousands of generic 'Spiritual counselors' that blight the Earth, using language loosely and vaguely, trying to convince others of their sageness without ever actually clarifying anything.

 

Ambiguity is the enemy of understanding, you employ it well.

[Robin-H]

Cyclone is right, you talk like any one of the thousands of generic 'Spiritual counselors' that blight the Earth, using language loosely and vaguely, trying to convince others of their sageness without ever actually clarifying anything.

 

Ambiguity is the enemy of understanding, you employ it well.

 

100%

 

It's all just been nonsensical word soup - it doesn't mean anything.

[RootsBooster]

Most people who have discovered what I have tried to explain here have been told to get lost by people who aren't interested and prefer to remain identified with their mind. I am not supprised same thing happens here.

 

Sorry but you don't get to play the victim, nobody has told you to get lost, we've only asked that you clearly explain what you're talking about.

You've spent page after long winded page dancing around it, avoiding commitment to any specifics.

If something is worth saying, it can usually be said in a few words.

 

I'm reminded of my own forum signature

[danot]

Dutch offered an explanation on what consciousness is, what it's connected to (or an extension of if you like- "the borderless, none physical, hollow emptiness), and also explained a technique he/she uses which allows it to reconnect with his/her consciousness. What more can they tell you?

[Cyclone]

He described the silence of successful meditation. For no apparent reason he then claims that this lack of thinking is consciousness and that it can't be measured only experienced.

Sounds like total nonsense to me. But what he didn't do was describe what consciousness IS. In fact he conveniently defines it as something that only he has experienced and which can't be measured. Much like the soul I suppose.

[RootsBooster]

Dutch offered an explanation on what consciousness is, what it's connected to (or an extension of if you like- "the borderless, none physical, hollow emptiness), and also explained a technique he/she uses which allows it to reconnect with his/her consciousness. What more can they tell you?

 

You've just described a void. Do you really think that's an accurate description of consciousness?

[dutch]

He described the silence of successful meditation. For no apparent reason he then claims that this lack of thinking is consciousness and that it can't be measured only experienced.

Sounds like total nonsense to me. But what he didn't do was describe what consciousness IS. In fact he conveniently defines it as something that only he has experienced and which can't be measured. Much like the soul I suppose.

 

It is not easy to describe what consciousness is in words because these words are confined, they have a limit. You can't describe something limitless with words that stick to a meaning.

This is just a forum and I am not writing a book about my experiences. But will try again, just having my coffee. Consciousness is everywhere and everything, go to stanage edge it is there and the rocks are in it part of it. A tree is in it part of it. The ocean is in it part of it. You are in it part of it. Conscious is all and the material is only a part of it. Everything material has a border, edge, birth, death. Although consciousness is not material, it can be seen and observed when we do become aware of it and find the connection. Its taken me years to find this connection but really it could happen instantly under certain circumstances it doesn't need to take years. It could happen instantly this moment.

Cyclone you again asked what it is. It is your centre, who you are, it is seeing watching all your thoughts your dreams, emotions. You are still unaware of it but there must have been small glimpses in your life where you have been in short contact with consciousness.

By the way when meditation reaches its peak success and failure disappear you just feel love and blissfulness.

 

---------- Post added 07-08-2018 at 10:27 ----------

 

You've just described a void. Do you really think that's an accurate description of consciousness?

 

Yes.

 

But there are different people who interpret or use that word differently, I am trying to use this word to point to this void.

There have been others who called it super consciousness but I don't like to use that word. Some people call it awareness, awareness and consciousness are closely related. I use the word awareness to point to the possible awakening of the unconscious mind to become aware and connect and see consciousness again.

 

---------- Post added 07-08-2018 at 11:29 ----------

 

An atheist and theist are both religious.

One beliefs religion the other rejects it, they are just the positive and negative of the same religious battery.

Neither understands the meaning of religion therefore they struggle with its meaning and tension builds up. Religious people can be very tense, one little spark and they can start a war.

Is that the meaning of religion, being confused, not understanding believing in stupid scriptures or rejecting them completely as an atheist?

Becoming aware of these unconscious religions and seeing they are all thoughts, believes, dreams. This seeing happens by moving out of their confined mind and putting it to rest allowing the real meaning of what some of these scriptures try to say to be seen again. When that happens you move beyond religion and can say "I am god, I am all, I am the universe" like jesus and others have done but you better don't say it, he got crucified for saying that.

Edited August 7, 2018 by dutch