Climate Change thread

[Chekhov]

1 hour ago, ads36 said:

Yes.

Climate change isn't a binary situation. there are degrees (literally) of change.

ranging from : +1°C : this is roughly where we are now.

to : +4°C (or more!) : literally the extinction of most life on earth, including humans.

we still get to choose which future we want.

I do not believe that for one second.

 

>>we still get to choose which future we want<<

 

Except we, teh greta British public don't get a choice do we ?

All major parties are supporting this exterme Nett Zero dogma (just like they did with Covid suppression BTW, and look how that turned out), so what choice does anyone have in a GE ? It does, at least, mean they cannot sy they have a mandate for it.

[trastrick]

1 hour ago, ads36 said:

Yes.

 

Climate change isn't a binary situation. there are degrees (literally) of change.

 

ranging from : +1°C : this is roughly where we are now.

 

to : +4°C (or more!) : literally the extinction of most life on earth, including humans.

 

we still get to choose which future we want.

 

 

 

 

Acting on climate will save us money.

 

More public transport, better insulated houses, more renewable power, regrowing our lost forests, restoring our wetlands.

 

all of those things are money-savers. And we should be doing them *anyway*.

So it is very important to know how much the Earth is actually heating, before the $trillions are spent, right?

 

Without "anomalies" "nth warmest" , arbitrary averages etc.

 

Can anybody tell me the actual Earth's average temperature for each year of the NOAA/NASA satellite record since 1979. (the last 44 years)?

 

Anybody?

[Chekhov]

1 hour ago, ads36 said:

Acting on climate will save us money.

More public transport, better insulated houses, more renewable power, regrowing our lost forests, restoring our wetlands.

all of those things are money-savers. And we should be doing them *anyway*.

That depends on how far they force us to go.

 

Who would argue aganst better insulated homes ? Just so long as they still have the same number of windows and don't suffer from damp due to lack of ventilation, esp if those being canvassed for their opinion aren't paying for it.

But we've done most of the easy insulation, making houses without wall cavities more energy efficient starts getting veruy expensive and very messy

 

More renewable power ? So long as its reliable and economical who coudl object, but what happens when the wind stops blowing and/or its cloudy or dark ?

 

 Regrowing our lost forests ? again, another Motherhood and Apple Pie policy.

 

What you haven't mentioned is all the rest of the stuff they'll demand, like no more internal combustion vehicles, no more gas boilers and huge taxes on power / transport / flights, or even worse, it's actually rationed !

 

[ads36]

7 minutes ago, trastrick said:

So it is very important to know how much the Earth is actually heating, before the $trillions are spent, right?

Actually No.

 

because the things we need to do to act on climate change, are generally things we need to be doing anyway.

 

insulating houses, better public transport, more renewable energy, restoring our natural environment (forests, wetlands, etc.), etc.

 

3 minutes ago, Chekhov said:

But we've done most of the easy insulation

we *really* haven't.

 

UK houses are the worst insulated in Europe.

 

we've barely even tried.

Edited February 22, 2023 by ads36

[trastrick]

6 minutes ago, ads36 said:

Actually No.

 

because the things we need to do to act on climate change, are generally things we need to be doing anyway.

 

insulating houses, better public transport, more renewable energy, restoring our natural environment (forests, wetlands, etc.), etc.

Hmmmmm,  OK!  

 

Edited February 22, 2023 by trastrick

[Chekhov]

3 minutes ago, ads36 said:

>>Chekhov said:
But we've done most of the easy insulation<<

 

we *really* haven't.

UK houses are the worst insulated in Europe.

we've barely even tried.

Are you saying we are not into teh law of dimishing returns ? It;d be the first time ever if that were not the case. Surely it's obvious all the easy stuff will have been done first.

 

>>UK houses are the worst insulated in Europe.<<

 

I can remember listening to an article on R4 on that infamous quote, and apparentlyit doesn't actually mean what most people think it means. Soem of the factors were that we have fewer people living in flats / tower blocks which are naturaklly better insulated as they have fewer external walls or roofs. Also, because GB was not invaded during the war, nor bombed that much (contarty to what people seem to think) the UK housing stock is amongst the oldest in Europe. Thus insulating that "to modern standards" is uneconomic or even impossible.

It is NOT the case there is a high proportion of houses out there where we just have to insulate the lofts, insulate the wall cavities and install double glazing (the vast majority of houses, where it is practicable, already have the latter anyway).

[trastrick]

We are doing what we can afford to do as always. Cleaner air, water and feeding the World, 

 

We always did,  it’s called human progress!

 

(Long before the charlatans like AlGore, Goddess Greta, Kerry and the rest got rich off it)

 

 

 

 

Edited February 22, 2023 by trastrick

[Anna B]

According to Stephen Fry, the earth was over10 degrees warmer during the Jurasic period, with no ice caps at the North or South pole. 

We've also had ice ages and a 'snowball earth' period when the earth was entirely covered in ice and snow. 

So extremes of temperature changes without any human intervention.

 

We never hear about sun spots these days either.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Chekhov said:

Are you saying we are not into teh law of dimishing returns ? It;d be the first time ever if that were not the case. Surely it's obvious all the easy stuff will have been done first.

 

>>UK houses are the worst insulated in Europe.<<

 

I can remember listening to an article on R4 on that infamous quote, and apparentlyit doesn't actually mean what most people think it means. Soem of the factors were that we have fewer people living in flats / tower blocks which are naturaklly better insulated as they have fewer external walls or roofs. Also, because GB was not invaded during the war, nor bombed that much (contarty to what people seem to think) the UK housing stock is amongst the oldest in Europe. Thus insulating that "to modern standards" is uneconomic or even impossible.

It is NOT the case there is a high proportion of houses out there where we just have to insulate the lofts, insulate the wall cavities and install double glazing (the vast majority of houses, where it is practicable, already have the latter anyway).

I would advise you to edit the bit in bold unless you want to look an even bigger idiot than usual.

I lived through the war and remember all the bombed houses in our district that we played on.

I remember the state of Exchange St, High St, Angel St and The Moor and I have a large collection of photographs to back me up.

We were lucky that they were not good at bombing our industry but housing and commercial premises WERE badly hit.

[Magilla]

1 hour ago, Anna B said:

According to Stephen Fry, the earth was over10 degrees warmer during the Jurasic period, with no ice caps at the North or South pole.

...and no humans, but plenty of evidence that the current staple crops won't deliver the nutrient or protein content humans need at the associated carbon levels in the atmosphere.

 

Quote

We've also had ice ages and a 'snowball earth' period when the earth was entirely covered in ice and snow. 

So extremes of temperature changes without any human intervention.

The point being that this time it is a result of human intervention.

 

Quote

We never hear about sun spots these days either.

Not so, the Sun has left it's solar minimum, sunspot activity is well ahead of schedule... the sun is unusually active.

 

Here's a pic from today:

 

 

Edited February 22, 2023 by Magilla