Knife attacks in Sheffield 2018

[Baron99]

Glad they caught them....but things like this shouldn't be happening. Funding cuts, in many areas, are the cause- whether you choose to believe rhat or not doesn't matter. There have been big funding cuts- crime has increased.

 

So you choose to blame the parents as it's easier. What about if the parents are the problem? Blame their parents? An endless cycle of recrimination while nothing changes. Give people a reason tp value their lives and the lives of others and they respond well. Remove all that and you have people who feel they have no opportunities, nothing to lose and that society doesn't want them. That's what is going on.

 

Sure though- carry on blaming parents, smartphones, whatever. The problems will continue and nothing will ever, ever change.

 

It's very telling that your 'blame the parents' outbursts offer absolutely no solution to the problems. Just blame.

 

Ask yourself, why hasn't anyone on here, (I presume), been convicted of a serious crime? I think you'll find that it's because we were all brought up be decent parents & depending on your age, I seem to remember much tougher & as deprived backgrounds decades ago for the lower & working classes.

 

I was told on a few occasions how my children were a credit to my wife & me & they also reflect us. Society didn't or the various governments of the past didn't bring my children up so society & governments don't get to wallow in that praise.

 

When children are bad these days I don't blame society or government but start with the parents, including the absent fathers.

[Guest makapaka]

Glad they caught them....but things like this shouldn't be happening. Funding cuts, in many areas, are the cause- whether you choose to believe rhat or not doesn't matter. There have been big funding cuts- crime has increased.

 

So you choose to blame the parents as it's easier. What about if the parents are the problem? Blame their parents? An endless cycle of recrimination while nothing changes. Give people a reason tp value their lives and the lives of others and they respond well. Remove all that and you have people who feel they have no opportunities, nothing to lose and that society doesn't want them. That's what is going on.

 

Sure though- carry on blaming parents, smartphones, whatever. The problems will continue and nothing will ever, ever change.

 

It's very telling that your 'blame the parents' outbursts offer absolutely no solution to the problems. Just blame.

 

You’re absolutely right Paula - couldn’t have replied better myself.

[paula4sheff]

How do you know they've caught them?

 

Sorry- just assuming the people they've arrested are responsible. They of course might not be.

 

---------- Post added 22-09-2018 at 18:23 ----------

 

Ask yourself, why hasn't anyone on here, (I presume), been convicted of a serious crime? I think you'll find that it's because we were all brought up be decent parents & depending on your age, I seem to remember much tougher & as deprived backgrounds decades ago for the lower & working classes.

 

I was told on a few occasions how my children were a credit to my wife & me & they also reflect us. Society didn't or the various governments of the past didn't bring my children up so society & governments don't get to wallow in that praise.

 

When children are bad these days I don't blame society or government but start with the parents, including the absent fathers.

 

An absolute insult to single mothers.

 

I know of a great many people who had awful parents, and turned out great.

 

Likewise there are many people with 'decent parents' who have gone on to be criminals. You can start with someone like Jeffrey Archer if you like.

 

Bad parents are nothing new....they haven't sprung up in the past year or so to explain the rise in violent crime I'm afraid. You'll have to find something else to blame....

Edited September 22, 2018 by paula4sheff

[ECCOnoob]

Sorry- just assuming the people they've arrested are responsible. They of course might not be.

 

---------- Post added 22-09-2018 at 18:23 ----------

 

 

An absolute insult to single mothers.

 

I know of a great many people who had awful parents, and turned out great.

 

Likewise there are many people with 'decent parents' who have gone on to be criminals. You can start with someone like Jeffrey Archer if you like.

 

Bad parents are nothing new....they haven't sprung up in the past year or so to explain the rise in violent crime I'm afraid. You'll have to find something else to blame....

 

.....and you will have to find something else to blame than the simplistic response of blaming the Tory government and their cuts.

 

I ask you again. What do you think throwing money at the Police would have done to change this crime.

 

You have criminals who will not engaged in any so called Community Policing tactic. You have Police who cannot stop and search, cannot profile and track people, cannot monitor people's internet movements, cannot spy on people's phone calls and texts and cannot (no matter how much money you throw at it) be in every single part of the world at evey single second of the day.

 

You have a society who recoil in horror as soon as the words surveillance and police security are mentioned. You have human rights campaigners, lobbyists and lawyers ready to block any form of random stop and search, screening or monitoring and a wider public who would whine and moan if every single time they entered a public venue they had to have a security search and bag check. Jesus, there is enough moaning goes off when people have to do it in an airport.

 

So, I ask again. How would the police budget increase and a million and 1 extra officers out on the streets magically fix it.

 

You can argue all you want, but you are not going to change my position that upbringing has a lot of impact on a person's behaviour. Parents out working just aint gonna cut it. Both my parents work as did a huge majority of others. They worked in the days before flexible hours, work from home, shared parental leave and a 1001 other benefits modern day parents have. Them being out at work didn't stop me and the rest of my siblings being raised properly.

Edited September 22, 2018 by ECCOnoob

[dutch]

We need another good thorough expensive inquiry by intelligent educated people who understand everything. All problems can be solved that way.

[Guest makapaka]

.....and you will have to find something else to blame than the simplistic response of blaming the Tory government and their cuts.

 

I ask you again. What do you think throwing money at the Police would have done to change this crime.

 

You have criminals who will not engaged in any so called Community Policing tactic. You have Police who cannot stop and search, cannot profile and track people, cannot monitor people's internet movements, cannot spy on people's phone calls and texts and cannot (no matter how much money you throw at it) be in every single part of the world at evey single second of the day.

 

You have a society who recoil in horror as soon as the words surveillance and police security are mentioned. You have human rights campaigners, lobbyists and lawyers ready to block any form of random stop and search, screening or monitoring and a wider public who would whine and moan if every single time they entered a public venue they had to have a security search and bag check. Jesus, there is enough moaning goes off when people have to do it in an airport.

 

So, I ask again. How would the police budget increase and a million and 1 extra officers out on the streets magically fix it.

 

You can argue all you want, but you are not going to change my position that upbringing has a lot of impact on a person's behaviour. Parents out working just aint gonna cut it. Both my parents work as did a huge majority of others. They worked in the days before flexible hours, work from home, shared parental leave and a 1001 other benefits modern day parents have. Them being out at work didn't stop me and the rest of my siblings being raised properly.

 

I don’t think anyone’s saying it would solve it. But cutting police is not going to help is it?

 

If policing has such little effect then why bother any more with bobbies - let’s just wait for crimes to happen - blame it on the parents.

 

Poverty is also an issue that the government is responsible for - which has a direct correlation to increased crime.

 

Anyone saying that cutting 21000 police officers in 8 years is not at least a contributory factor is way off.

Edited September 22, 2018 by makapaka

[tinfoilhat]

I don’t think anyone’s saying it would solve it. But cutting police is not going to help is it?

 

If policing has such little effect then why bother any more with bobbies - let’s just wait for crimes to happen - blame it on the parents.

 

Poverty is also an issue that the government is responsible for - which has a direct correlation to increased crime.

 

Anyone saying that cutting 21000 police officers in 8 years is not at least a contributory factor is way off.

 

I'm trying to work out how it would be a contributing factor in this particular case? Would they have nicked these n'er do wells over some other trivial matter? Would they have stopped and searched them on their way there? Would there be a police presence at centertainment prior to say, 2008?

 

I'm not saying more police aren't helpful but I'm not sure in this case? You're right about poverty of course but that's been around prior to cuts.

[woodmally]

I don’t think anyone’s saying it would solve it. But cutting police is not going to help is it?

 

If policing has such little effect then why bother any more with bobbies - let’s just wait for crimes to happen - blame it on the parents.

 

Poverty is also an issue that the government is responsible for - which has a direct correlation to increased crime.

 

Anyone saying that cutting 21000 police officers in 8 years is not at least a contributory factor is way off.

 

Firstly I remember a lot of people in the 50s and 60s didnt have much money but still crime was low. Why was that. Simple if you did something wrong you got your rear end tanned (smacking is now seen as bad).

 

Secondly yes police numbers are falling and that is an issue but not causing this problem. What would increased police have done to prevent this stabbing. Nothing they wouldnt even have been able to stop and search the perpetrator. All they can do is have knife amnesties.

[Top Cats Hat]

As with everything, there is no one cause but a number of causes some major, some minor.

 

I would say that levels of policing play a part but not a major one. Most stabbing incidents aren't planned but impulsive. In that situation, it is unlikely that even a passing police officer would prevent something which takes no more than a second. I can't remember the exact figure but there was a statistic that used to go around along the lines of if a police officer was on the beat 24/7 for 20 years they would never randomly happen upon a crime in progress. Visible policing is as much a PR exercise as an operational one. It may deter someone about to break into a car or mug someone, but it won't stop it happening, merely delay it or move it to the next street.

 

Stop and search will only go so far. Kids these days are wise, and knives would just be dumped or carried by others during most stop and search operations. Investigations into stabbings are hampered not by police numbers, but the fact that most kids won't inform on other kids either through misguided loyalty or fear of reprisals.

 

So rather than shouting "Lock them up for longer!" and more stop and search powers for the police we need to be looking at why these things are happening in the first place.

[Penistone999]

This is what happens under a government that continues to cut services and also makes people poorer.

 

There are lots of people who dont have much money ,and live on a tight budget, it dosnt make them go out and stab someone.

 

---------- Post added 22-09-2018 at 20:05 ----------

 

I remember the days when an argument was settled by fists.!

 

Me too . Thats how we settled things when we were younger.