£8,000 a month care home fees.

[Obelix]

Hmmm...

 

... OK, so using your figures Mr Obelix, let's say all the costs amount to £1,000 per week per 'guest', or roughly £4000 per month.

 

So that's 100% markup or £4,000 per month 'profit' per guest.

 

And how many guests do they have? Let's say 20 (does anyone have any accurate info?).

 

So that's 20 x £4,000 per month, or £80,000 profit per month, or approaching £1million a year!

 

And you don't think that the nursing home is too bad on price?

 

Where on earth do you get those numbers from? It's £8000 a month for TWO people not one.

 

£975 for one that needs full time nursing care a week.

[Mr Bloke]

Wasn't Anna's first post saying it was £8000 for 2 people?

Ooops...

 

... sorry, I missed that.

[truman]

Ooops...

 

... sorry, I missed that.

 

So from making a million profit a year the care home is making nowt ... that's why they're closing down..

[Baron99]

Have a look at how the owners of care homes live....

 

Quite a number of homes are owned by doctors.

 

I know of a couple who are planning ahead for such an eventuality as having to go into care at some later stage. For a few hundred quid at a solicitors, they transferred their home to their children, so that was their main asset gone then they keep passing money to thier kids to keep their bank balance around the £30k mark.

 

If you don't have any assets then the local authority will pay.

[Obelix]

Just make sure you live more than seven years beyond teh date of gifting and that they kids are charging you *market* rent for living in the house otherwise the council can apply for an order to negate the gifting of the house.

[Longcol]

Why?

 

If it was done on the cheap then you'd be on here moaning like a shot.

 

Go on - cost up what a nursing team needs to bill a week for care, plus the cost of providing the room and see what you get to.

 

15 years ago I worked for a housing association that ran a few nursing homes (not a major part of the business). One of my duties was to draw up the annual budget for presentation to the Health Authority who paid a top up grant to meet costs over and above what the LA paid in fees.

 

To run a 40 bed unit 24/7, 365 days of the year, cost over £800 per bed per week then, so a charge of £975pw in 2018 doesn't surprise me in the slightest.

[El Cid]

The local authority may charge people for care and support services, and for arranging them, but some types of care and support must be free of charge.

[tinfoilhat]

The local authority may charge people for care and support services, and for arranging them, but some types of care and support must be free of charge.

 

If you've not worked at all in your life and in rented accommodation and you need to move into a nursing home, the council will put you in a nursing home at minimal cost (ie they'll have your state pension). Its all means tested.

[Cyclone]

I thought I run some numbers rather than wait for Anna, see waht you make of these.

 

One person with 24 hr nursing cover is going to require three shifts of eight hours. Assuming each nurse actually looks after six people, then six residents need three nurses plus a "half" nurse to allow for nurses on holidays, sick, leave, etc.

 

So thats 7/12th FTE for a nurse as staffing costs. A RN in adult care is well paid median salary is 38k. Add in employers NI (+4k) and pension requirements (1400) you get a figure of 45400 just for staffing costs.

 

7/12th of that spread over 52.4 weeks is £480 a week. Thats just for a nurse to be there...

 

Add on rates and rent, building depreciation, food, staff to cook it, clean, laundry, etc. that makes it £450 for the week for all that. Thats only cheap hotel rates and they have economies of scale.

 

I dont actually think that nursing home is too bad on price looking at that...

 

You could stay in a luxury resort as a couple for a lot less than 8k/month, so even if you dedicated £2k to the nursing, that's a lot of money for facilities that will be considerably less well appointed than a luxury holiday location.

 

---------- Post added 25-09-2018 at 18:25 ----------

 

So if it's easy money why don't the council open more care homes? The one my dad was in briefly was council, not that well specced and the same as a private care home.

 

The council are willing to pay about half that. Which according to the calcs is approximately the actual cost, but no profit...

 

---------- Post added 25-09-2018 at 18:25 ----------

 

Yes I was just going to post to same thing. The £8000 figure was for two people. When my nan went into a care home (with bad dementia) it was £1000 a week, which is what this equates to.

 

2nd resident doesn't actually need nursing care, certainly not dementia level support.

[Anna B]

I thought I run some numbers rather than wait for Anna, see waht you make of these.

 

One person with 24 hr nursing cover is going to require three shifts of eight hours. Assuming each nurse actually looks after six people, then six residents need three nurses plus a "half" nurse to allow for nurses on holidays, sick, leave, etc.

 

So thats 7/12th FTE for a nurse as staffing costs. A RN in adult care is well paid median salary is 38k. Add in employers NI (+4k) and pension requirements (1400) you get a figure of 45400 just for staffing costs.

 

7/12th of that spread over 52.4 weeks is £480 a week. Thats just for a nurse to be there...

 

Add on rates and rent, building depreciation, food, staff to cook it, clean, laundry, etc. that makes it £450 for the week for all that. Thats only cheap hotel rates and they have economies of scale.

 

I dont actually think that nursing home is too bad on price looking at that...

 

Having known people in care homes, I can assure you that there is no 1 to 1 care available that I know of. I've certainly never seen it. One care worker may have to look after the entire night shift of people. Fine if they are all asleep, but they usually are not. There will also probably be a nurse on duty but she will be dealing with paper work etc rather than hands on.

 

As for daytime, maybe 3 carers will be looking after up to 20 patients. Patients have to wait until a carer is available to help them with basic things like going to the toilet, (sometimes too late.) There will be difficulties getting a doctor to visit, unless it is a dire emergency, and not always then. He may visit regularly once a week, if you're lucky, but more often than not, he will not visit for 'chronic' conditions, and may visit as litle as once a month.

 

I wish I could be more specific in what I've actually witnessed, bbut it would probably breach rules of confidentiality. I can say however, that in my experience, what they pronise in the glossy brochure, and what they actually deliver are miles apart.