BrexitGuy Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 2 minutes ago, taxman said: Being wilfully ignorant of facts and expert opinions seems to be the default position of a lot of people nowadays, they even seem proud of their stupidity. Just because somebody doesn't believe an expert opinion does not invalidate that opinion. Does a Flat Earther's belief mean that opinions to the contrary are "hogwash"? And there proves my point. Opinions cannot be invalidated because they can never be validated either. But I agree you have every right to be proud of your stupidity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Opinions can definitely be validated or invalidated when they're objective and not subjective. You can't prove that I like sprouts (subjective), but you can prove that I'm not the emperor of Japan (objective). On 12/10/2018 at 10:40 PM, BrexitGuy said: It staggers me how buses and trucks are the ones in the firing line. The very same vehicles that move masses of people and masses of products for the people. I remember some years back the tanker lorries having a strike and within two days the country was on its bottom. Imagine if lorry firms and bus firms were fined for running their services in towns. Just more pathetic idiots believing our emissions are causing climate change. Cant ever remember there being exhaust emissions being around during the last ice age. Diesels are good.......oh no, they're not.... Fats are bad........ Oh no, there good for us..... Statistics and expert opinions are only right when the person reading them believes it. The rest of the time they are utter hogwash. This is an opinion that could be validated or invalidated. I believe that there's a strong correlation between wanting brexit and denying climate change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrexitGuy Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 30 minutes ago, Cyclone said: Opinions can definitely be validated or invalidated when they're objective and not subjective. You can't prove that I like sprouts (subjective), but you can prove that I'm not the emperor of Japan (objective). This is an opinion that could be validated or invalidated. I believe that there's a strong correlation between wanting brexit and denying climate change. You cannot deny that officials are changing their minds regarding what's good or bad or what attributes to climate change. The diesel scenario was an absolute corker. You can try and explain what's subjective or objective but somewhere down the line the roles can and will be completely turned upside down. That is the most prolific problem with opinion........ It can change overnight. Mrs Cyclone might even do you sprouts on the holy day and you never know how your taste buds will react🍰 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mouserat Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Opinions may have changed on diesel, but the facts haven't. Diesels are more efficient than petrol engines and produce less CO2 emissions. That's why people were encouraged to buy them. Diesels produce more harmful emissions, particularly carcinogens in the particulate emissions. The impact of these emissions is greater in urban environments. That's why the use of them is now being discouraged (aside from the move away towards lower emission vehicles anyway, and the emergence of electric / hybrid vehicles as a viable, affordable option). Opinion on diesels has changed because our assessment of the benefit of them as more efficient vehicles versus the damage they cause with emissions has altered. And that is partly because we have more data on that impact on them. Because that's how science works. It derives theories based on empirical data, and when more data is collected, those theories may be disproved or altered. Climate change isn't opinion - it's science. And our understanding of that science will change, but I'd trust the "opinion" of scientists who have spent decades researching it over the opinion of someone who can't distinguish opinion from fact. Refusing to adapt to changing information with respect to diesels is a little like continuing to support Brexit when absolutely everyone is telling you that it will be an economic disaster for the UK, just because you made your mind up once and you don't like changing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fill Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) On 10/12/2018 at 22:40, BrexitGuy said: It staggers me how buses and trucks are the ones in the firing line. The very same vehicles that move masses of people and masses of products for the people. I remember some years back the tanker lorries having a strike and within two days the country was on its bottom. Imagine if lorry firms and bus firms were fined for running their services in towns. Just more pathetic idiots believing our emissions are causing climate change. Cant ever remember there being exhaust emissions being around during the last ice age. Diesels are good.......oh no, they're not.... Fats are bad........ Oh no, there good for us..... Statistics and expert opinions are only right when the person reading them believes it. The rest of the time they are utter hogwash. well said and any taxaton that is labelled a 'greenhouse tax on... ' is also <removed> how is the revenue raised from said tax going to help prevent inevitable natural climate change? some migh deter the less well off from doing certain things.. get used to that .. in time it will be the more well off that dictate what the less well off can and may do.... just wait and see Edited January 17, 2019 by nikki-red Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightrider Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 On 12/12/2018 at 11:07, Mouserat said: Opinions may have changed on diesel, but the facts haven't. Diesels are more efficient than petrol engines and produce less CO2 emissions. That's why people were encouraged to buy them. Diesels produce more harmful emissions, particularly carcinogens in the particulate emissions. The impact of these emissions is greater in urban environments. That's why the use of them is now being discouraged (aside from the move away towards lower emission vehicles anyway, and the emergence of electric / hybrid vehicles as a viable, affordable option). Opinion on diesels has changed because our assessment of the benefit of them as more efficient vehicles versus the damage they cause with emissions has altered. And that is partly because we have more data on that impact on them. Because that's how science works. It derives theories based on empirical data, and when more data is collected, those theories may be disproved or altered. Climate change isn't opinion - it's science. And our understanding of that science will change, but I'd trust the "opinion" of scientists who have spent decades researching it over the opinion of someone who can't distinguish opinion from fact. Refusing to adapt to changing information with respect to diesels is a little like continuing to support Brexit when absolutely everyone is telling you that it will be an economic disaster for the UK, just because you made your mind up once and you don't like changing it. From what I have read this science was all well known when a previous government encouraged Diesel uptake. They just chose to ignore it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geared Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Yes I think I heard warnings were being made in the late 90's or something, but the priority was CO2 emissions so they were just brushed aside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim1 Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 Am I really going to have to pay £12.50 to come in to the city centre to shop? I must have read it wrong. I like to go to Waitrose and Mecca bingo. I come from Worksop. I put my car registration in the website Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeHasRisen Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Tim1 said: Am I really going to have to pay £12.50 to come in to the city centre to shop? I must have read it wrong. I like to go to Waitrose and Mecca bingo. I come from Worksop. I put my car registration in the website No. Cars are exempt and its not a tenner. Where are you reading its £12.50? You have bumped a 4 year old thread, there is another thread on the go here.... https://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/topic/481245-sheffield-congestion-charge-from-feb-27th-2023/ Edited February 1, 2023 by HeHasRisen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim1 Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 2 hours ago, HeHasRisen said: No. Cars are exempt and its not a tenner. Where are you reading its £12.50? You have bumped a 4 year old thread, there is another thread on the go here.... https://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/topic/481245-sheffield-congestion-charge-from-feb-27th-2023/ It was on the link from the gov website. I bumped a thread as the other thread I was reading linked this thread saying already been discussed here lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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