apelike Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, woodview said: Polls would be called by both national governments and taken separately by both the Republic and the North. If a majority in both say yes, then reunification can happen. Agreed but as there is no sitting government in NI no poll can take place there. 1 hour ago, Litotes said: The people I have been talking to want a chance to vote on the various options with a sigle transferable vote referendum so that the Leaver don't feel that the combined weight of their support is diluted - but the DO want a chance to express their views now that they have greater clarity on what 'leave' actually could mean... Unfortunately for you and them that is very unlikely to happen. Edited January 25, 2019 by apelike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Cats Hat Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 9 minutes ago, apelike said: No you have still got it backwards. The above cant happen until N.Ireland have a government in place with an executive and assembly that can allow a border poll to be taken as its only when that happens that a border poll in N.Ireland can take place. At the moment NI has no sitting assembly as it was suspended in 2017 and until that is back in place nothing can be put forward as strand 2 relies on it. 4 minutes ago, apelike said: Agreed but as there is no sitting government in NI no poll can take place. No, you still haven't got it have you? One last time. The devolved government at Stormont has NOTHING to do with a border poll. Think about it. If it did, the DUP could prevent a united Ireland simply by collapsing Stormont anytime a poll looked likely. Do you really think that Sinn Féin would ever have agreed to what is effectively a unionist veto on a united Ireland? It is the UK government through the Secretary of State who both calls and organises a border poll. That is why ultimately the DUP will have to choose between the North remaining in some form of customs union but still in the UK or take a real risk of ending up in a united Ireland (and definitely in a permanent customs union) The DUP may be a bunch of racist, religious crackpots but they are and always have been fairly politically savvy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penistone999 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Top Cats Hat said: It is only for reasons of political cowardice that it hasn't been cancelled, not because they are worried about Tommy Robinson calling a march. Why would the result of a democratic referendum be cancelled ? Remember , both the tories AND Labour pledged to honour the the result and deliver the result , so its time they did exactly that . 6 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said: No, you still haven't got it have you? One last time. The devolved government at Stormont has NOTHING to do with a border poll. Think about it. If it did, the DUP could prevent a united Ireland simply by collapsing Stormont anytime a poll looked likely. Do you really think that Sinn Féin would ever have agreed to what is effectively a unionist veto on a united Ireland? It is the UK government through the Secretary of State who both calls and organises a border poll. That is why ultimately the DUP will have to choose between the North remaining in some form of customs union but still in the UK or take a real risk of ending up in a united Ireland (and definitely in a permanent customs union) The DUP may be a bunch of racist, religious crackpots but they are and always have been fairly politically savvy! Religious crackpots , yes,but ive never heard anything remotely racist said by them. Edited January 25, 2019 by Penistone999 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retep Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 30 minutes ago, Magilla said: Why, how does the reteputer represent the number? Here, https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/01/05/peoples-vote-march-attended-third-number-organisers-claimed/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodview Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 3 hours ago, CaptainSwing said: And even if we had been invited to express the strength of our opinions, I suspect we'd have ended up with a bimodal distribution centred on 0 and 10. A compromise might be the way forward, but for a lot of people it would be like asking for a compromise between life and death. A compromise is the preferred way with the public. I'm no fan of the queen, but her thinly veiled speech - She said: "As we look for new answers in the modern age, I for one prefer the tried and tested recipes, like speaking well of each other and respecting different points of view; coming together to seek out the common ground; and never losing sight of the bigger picture." In a Sky poll 68% agreed on this approach, with only 13% disagreeing. Regards those who liken it to a compromise on we life or death, I agree some are like that, but luckily they mostly inhabit internet forums, and not so much let out into the real world 😀 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Cats Hat Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 9 minutes ago, Penistone999 said: Why would the result of a democratic referendum be cancelled ? The result can't be cancelled, it exists as a historical event. However that result was inconclusive with neither side gaining an overall majority and the legislation which allowed for it to be held, bound no government to act on it. So just as the government was free to choose how to respond to the referendum in 2016 they are just as free to take a different view in 2019, especially in light of the complete mess we are in, with or without a referendum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penistone999 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 1 minute ago, Top Cats Hat said: The result can't be cancelled, it exists as a historical event. However that result was inconclusive with neither side gaining an overall majority and the legislation which allowed for it to be held, bound no government to act on it. So just as the government was free to choose how to respond to the referendum in 2016 they are just as free to take a different view in 2019, especially in light of the complete mess we are in, with or without a referendum. We are only in a mess because our politicians seem incapable of carrying out one simple instruction from the Voters ......... Leave the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apelike Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 29 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said: It is the UK government through the Secretary of State who both calls and organises a border poll. My apologies, you are correct as that is still the situation despite devolution. One other thing I have learnt though is that any referenda on unification can only happen once every 7 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodview Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 7 minutes ago, apelike said: My apologies, you are correct as that is still the situation despite devolution. One other thing I have learnt though is that any referenda on unification can only happen once every 7 years. Junker and Barnier will be blessing a divided Ireland. The border has been their salvation in adding awkwardness to the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melthebell Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 35 minutes ago, Penistone999 said: We are only in a mess because our politicians seem incapable of carrying out one simple instruction from the Voters ......... Leave the EU. Leavers are simple...leaving the EU is far from simple simple? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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