Top Cats Hat Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 8 minutes ago, Phanerothyme said: Seriously, I don't understand how, post brexit, the UK can have an open and unobstructed land border with the EU. It's not so much a question of how can it have, as it has to. The peace agreement which ended thirty years of conflict included a guarantee that the border between North and South would exist as a line on a map but nothing more concrete than that. That guarantee is enshrined in law and is supported by both the UK and Irish governments. Therefore if the UK is going to leave the EU while Ireland remains, something needs to be done to accomodate that unusual situation. At the moment, the only thing that can accomodate it is either the UK remaining in a customs union with the EU which the hardcore Brexiteers won't accept or just the North of Ireland remains in a customs union with a border 'down the Irish Sea' which is unacceptable to the religious crackpots of the DUP who see it as making the North different to the rest of the UK (don't mention abortion rights, segregated schooling, gay marriage, high concrete walls between communities etc!) It is probably not possible to resolve so we will probably end up in a customs union anyway or remain in the EU. Hardline Brexiteers won't like it but they aren't exactly lining up with solutions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phanerothyme Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Car Boot said: Whenever I fly back from Northern Ireland I have to present my passport before boarding a plane. Identity checks are carried out on each passenger entering Great Britain. I don't see why this should change once we Leave the EU. The EU will enforce their hard border against the wishes of the Irish people and reap the consequences. When you travel from Ireland to the UK across the land border, you're saying you won't have to, aren't you? Is what you're saying, in effect, that you will be able to enter the UK from the EU with no immigration, customs or other border checks, if you drive out of Bridgend and head for Derry Town Centre, but not if you arrive from Calais or at Heathrow/wherever? 5 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said: It's not so much a question of how can it have, as it has to. The peace agreement which ended thirty years of conflict included a guarantee that the border between North and South would exist as a line on a map but nothing more concrete than that. That guarantee is enshrined in law and is supported by both the UK and Irish governments. Therefore if the UK is going to leave the EU while Ireland remains, something needs to be done to accomodate that unusual situation. At the moment, the only thing that can accomodate it is either the UK remaining in a customs union with the EU which the hardcore Brexiteers won't accept or just the North of Ireland remains in a customs union with a border 'down the Irish Sea' which is unacceptable to the religious crackpots of the DUP who see it as making the North different to the rest of the UK (don't mention abortion rights, segregated schooling, gay marriage, high concrete walls between communities etc!) It is probably not possible to resolve so we will probably end up in a customs union anyway or remain in the EU. Hardline Brexiteers won't like it but they aren't exactly lining up with solutions. Yeah. That's exactly what I was getting at - nice concise explanation of the whole debacle right there. I suppose Irish Reunification would provide a nice easy solution. Edited January 31, 2019 by Phanerothyme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Cats Hat Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 21 minutes ago, Car Boot said: Whenever I fly back from Northern Ireland I have to present my passport before boarding a plane. Really? Again you show your ignorance! There is no requirement to show a passport to either travel by air or sea to Northern Ireland fronm the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phanerothyme Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 Carriers however, are at liberty to insist on whatever documentation they want, more or less. My experience on the Fishguard - Rosslare ferry was a long time ago, before the GFA, and I didn't need a passport then. Or any id, just a ferry ticket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Car Boot Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 24 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said: Really? Again you show your ignorance! There is no requirement to show a passport to either travel by air or sea to Northern Ireland fronm the UK. There is a requirement to show a form of ID when entering Great Britain from Northern Ireland. I always take my passport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Car Boot Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 46 minutes ago, I1L2T3 said: Yes it would be attacked because it would be representative of the division of Ireland, a stituation that is the entire reason for the continued existence of the IRA. why else do you think they exist? And in previous incarnations they have killed police and army members from the republic before, some killed with bombs planted on the border. You simply do not have any clue. Yet despite what you say the EU has stated that it will enforce a hard border in Ireland, against the clear wishes of the UK and the Irish Republic. The EU will erect a hard border in the full knowledge that it may be attacked, and that lives will be put at risk by this action. The EU is dangerously irresponsible and is willing to risk a flare up of 'The Troubles' just so that business can maximise profit. NO to an EU Frontier in Ireland! NO to a hard EU border! NO to the EU! People BEFORE profit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Car Boot said: It's not me or the UK threatening to enforce a hard border on Ireland. It's your beloved EU. How can there not be border infrastructure with no deal. Explain Edited January 31, 2019 by I1L2T3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magilla Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 (edited) Brexit: Barclays moves £166bn out of the UK: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47060676 Edited January 31, 2019 by Magilla Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ads36 Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 All of this mess, that we can't sort out on here, is real, it was predicted, and no-one else knows how to fix it either. Unless, the UK stays in the custom union, or cancels A50. 3 choices, if we include continuing along this path which we know leads to bloody chaos. 'bloody chaos' would've looked good on that bus... In other news, car manufacturing investment has fallen by 80%. That *might* not kill off UK car manufacturing, but there's a solemn looking undertaker with a tape measure, sizing up a coffin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 16 hours ago, apelike said: You are getting to sound like THC , that cant be correct as the entire country was not given a vote. That means that the country can't have voted either way in a strong showing. It doesn't in any way stop the country being divided does it. 7 hours ago, Car Boot said: Whenever I fly back from Northern Ireland I have to present my passport before boarding a plane. Identity checks are carried out on each passenger entering Great Britain. I don't see why this should change once we Leave the EU. The EU will enforce their hard border against the wishes of the Irish people and reap the consequences. Actually you don't. It's an internal flight and a photocard ID would be acceptable. Or you could take the ferry where no ID would be required. And you're talking about personal travel, not the movement of goods. 7 hours ago, Car Boot said: It's not me or the UK threatening to enforce a hard border on Ireland. It's your beloved EU. It's international law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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