I1L2T3 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Lockdoctor said: Yes, I am an immigrant. My place of birth is a Commonwealth country. I have always felt comfortable during the time I have lived in the UK. I don't consider the issue of immigration as a toxic issue because I am am a reasonable person and acknowledge since the EU expanded more and more people from EU countries are allowed to come to the UK without restriction. It is sensible to have have a controlled immigration policy and the more countries which join the EU mean the UK have less control of immigration numbers, if the UK don't leave the EU. The issue of Turkey becoming a future member of the EU was fully justified in being debated during the EU referendum campaign given the fact the UK Prime Minister at the time had previously supported Turkey joining the EU. The debate should have taken less ten seconds. Is Turkey joining the EU? No The end We always had the means to control immigration. We just chose not to. 1 hour ago, Lex Luthor said: Correct, added to the fact that everything is about London at the expense of everywhere else and we've seen social cleansing of London, shoving the least fortunate up North where they can't be seen and they can't be heard. And who's speaking up for the disabled and the impoverished as they are increasingly degraded and bullied by this government and further money is being taken away from them? I fear our politicians are recreating the climate of 1930s Germany. Watching the pathetic C4 program about the leave campaign last week, I thought at least they used the private purse for their ends and didn't use treasury money to send a book to everyone full of lies and broken promises, isn't that a real offence? If not it should be. The recent increased emphasis on a London-centric remainer elite suggests to me we are: 1. Getting A50 extension so that... 2. Tories can go for broke and call another GE This is softening up of the electorate Edited January 19, 2019 by I1L2T3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ez8004 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Lex Luthor said: Correct, added to the fact that everything is about London at the expense of everywhere else and we've seen social cleansing of London, shoving the least fortunate up North where they can't be seen and they can't be heard. And who's speaking up for the disabled and the impoverished as they are increasingly degraded and bullied by this government and further money is being taken away from them? I fear our politicians are recreating the climate of 1930s Germany. Watching the pathetic C4 program about the leave campaign last week, I thought at least they used the private purse for their ends and didn't use treasury money to send a book to everyone full of lies and broken promises, isn't that a real offence? If not it should be. Not really on two specific points. Firstly, London funds itself MANY times over. London contributes nearly 25% of the NATIONAL GDP alone. If anything, we rely on London funding the rest of the country. Also, from a population perspective, London getting a large share for development is expected purely because of the amount of people who live there. As always, you're making statements with no facts to back them up. Edited January 19, 2019 by ez8004 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Cats Hat Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 1 hour ago, Lockdoctor said: the more countries which join the EU mean the UK have less control of immigration numbers, No, the level of control over immigration remains the same regardless of the number of countries which join the EU. By the way, if Erdogan was deposed tonight and democracy was restored to Turkey tomorrow, you'd still be at least 10-20 years away from Turkey getting anywhere near qualification to join the EU, and Erdogan intends being there for many years yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodview Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 6 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said: No, the level of control over immigration remains the same regardless of the number of countries which join the EU. By the way, if Erdogan was deposed tonight and democracy was restored to Turkey tomorrow, you'd still be at least 10-20 years away from Turkey getting anywhere near qualification to join the EU, and Erdogan intends being there for many years yet. They said over numbers eg the more countries that are entitled to FoM, the more people are entitled to come here. Don't know where your timeline comes from, but anyway, in 10 years the largest member would become Turkey, with most MEPs. How would having the largest block of MEPs coming from a muslim country affect things? I'd like to see bans on halal and kosher slaughter for example, that would become very difficult. A land border with Syria, Iraq and Iran shows how far a stretch from 'Europe' this would be. The process should never even have been started, the fact it was is telling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longcol Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 5 minutes ago, woodview said: They said over numbers eg the more countries that are entitled to FoM, the more people are entitled to come here. Don't know where your timeline comes from, but anyway, in 10 years the largest member would become Turkey, with most MEPs. 10 years from when? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodview Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 4 minutes ago, Longcol said: 10 years from when? Dont know, it was topcats figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longcol Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 19 minutes ago, woodview said: Dont know, it was topcats figure. So Turkey isn't going to have any MEP's - never mind the most - anytime soon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 27 minutes ago, woodview said: They said over numbers eg the more countries that are entitled to FoM, the more people are entitled to come here. Don't know where your timeline comes from, but anyway, in 10 years the largest member would become Turkey, with most MEPs. How would having the largest block of MEPs coming from a muslim country affect things? I'd like to see bans on halal and kosher slaughter for example, that would become very difficult. A land border with Syria, Iraq and Iran shows how far a stretch from 'Europe' this would be. The process should never even have been started, the fact it was is telling. Good grief You so desperately want Turkey joining the EU to be true, but your own post provides enough ammo to indicate why it’s never going to happen. A modernised democratic non-secular Turkey might stand a chance. But a secular state that is effectively a dictatorship in the process of rolling back numerous aspects of modernisation (press freedom, human rights etc...) is never going to be joining. The irony is that the point were Leave tried to convince everyone that Turkey is joining, is the point where Erdogan was pressing home his power and making EU accession impossible He’s rolled back the strength of the Turkish accession case to even before the 1980s My kids are adults now and it won’t happen in their lifetimes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodview Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 2 minutes ago, Longcol said: So Turkey isn't going to have any MEP's - never mind the most - anytime soon? The discussion is about if they should get membership, which they have applied for and in process of. 2 minutes ago, I1L2T3 said: Good grief You so desperately want Turkey joining the EU to be true, but your own post provides enough ammo to indicate why it’s never going to happen. A modernised democratic non-secular Turkey might stand a chance. But a secular state that is effectively a dictatorship in the process of rolling back numerous aspects of modernisation (press freedom, human rights etc...) is never going to be joining. The irony is that the point were Leave tried to convince everyone that Turkey is joining, is the point where Erdogan was pressing home his power and making EU accession impossible He’s rolled back the strength of the Turkish accession case to even before the 1980s My kids are adults now and it won’t happen in their lifetimes I assume you mean a 'secular' Turkey might be? Why is the membership still in-process? It's only suspended. Why was it even started? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longcol Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 19 minutes ago, woodview said: The discussion is about if they should get membership, which they have applied for and in process of. Not "processing" much is it? https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/erdogan-turkey-eu-full-membership-european-union-commitment-president-a8274166.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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