Consequences Of Brexit [Part 9] Read First Post Before Posting

[carosio]

1 hour ago, whiteowl said:

 

Erm, yes it can be denied. As has been mentioned before - one of the assurances that Cameron got when he went to the EU was an exemption for the UK from any closer political union, amongst other things. 

 

But certain press at the time claimed he had gotten nothing from the EU, and I guess people believed it. 

What were the other things?

[L00b]

1 hour ago, carosio said:

What were the other things?

Have a read

 

All academic now. Those were 'gets' whilst the UK was still in, and the relationship hadn't soured at all, relative to the extent that it has over the last 4 years.

 

By now, the UK would be very lucky to escape Schengen and the € if it rejoined soon...but then, by the time re-joining gets discussed to any realistic extent, the likelihood is that it won't even the 'UK' any more anyway.

 

What price political hubris.

 

EDIT- and looking at aftermath of Von der Leyden / Johnson phone call, it looks like Johnson's bluff did not work:

 

With @BorisJohnson, we took stock of the negotiations. The conditions for an agreement are not there due to remaining differences on critical issues. 
We asked our Chief Negotiators to prepare an overview of the remaining differences to be discussed in person in the coming days.

 

Curtains, I think.

Edited December 7, 2020 by L00b

[carosio]

44 minutes ago, L00b said:

Have a read

 

All academic now. Those were 'gets' whilst the UK was still in, and the relationship hadn't soured at all, relative to the extent that it has over the last 4 years.

 

By now, the UK would be very lucky to escape Schengen and the € if it rejoined soon...but then, by the time re-joining gets discussed to any realistic extent, the likelihood is that it won't even the 'UK' any more anyway.

 

What price political hubris.

True, academic now and leaving signs seals and delivers it, but several of the deals mentioned were not cut and dried, as highlighted by this EU Analysis  opinion.

 

https://fullfact.org/europe/explaining-eu-deal-it-legally-binding/?utm_source=content_page&utm_medium=related_conten

 

 

[L00b]

19 minutes ago, carosio said:

True, academic now and leaving signs seals and delivers it, but several of the deals mentioned were not cut and dried, as highlighted by this EU Analysis  opinion.

 

https://fullfact.org/europe/explaining-eu-deal-it-legally-binding/?utm_source=content_page&utm_medium=related_conten

It's been pointless discussing what Cameron fetched back from Brussels in February 2016, ever since Theresa May dropped the Article 50 letter back in March 2017, because the UK was garanteed to leave the EU by operation of law from that point forward.

 

And still more pointless, when the UK ceased being an EU member state altogether, nearly 3 years later, this past January.

 

Those get-outs were still not enough for the UK. So much so, that the UK wanted to leave the EU 4 months later and voted to do just that. Then the UK left. The end.

 

Not sure what else there is to say about these 'gets' from Cameron, tbh. More was unrealistic, for the exact same reasons the UK-EU deal has proven to be anything *but* that "easiest deal in history", and which are the exact same reasons the EU would rather no deal than a bad deal (-too). 

Edited December 7, 2020 by L00b

[sadbrewer]

2 hours ago, whiteowl said:

 

Erm, yes it can be denied. As has been mentioned before - one of the assurances that Cameron got when he went to the EU was an exemption for the UK from any closer political union, amongst other things. 

 

But certain press at the time claimed he had gotten nothing from the EU, and I guess people believed it. 

Actually it was a bit more nuanced than that, he got a written commitment that the UK was not ' expected' to undertake ever closer union, and that the words 'ever closer union' would not be used in the treaty text . A cynic might suggest that a non eurosceptic prime minister would accept ever closer union....just that the words would not be included in any treaty.

[tinfoilhat]

In other news those good people at VW will pay any tariffs that arise from a no deal Brexit if you order your new VW by December 31st. So not after 31st December by the look of it.

[altus]

Some good news at least.

 

UK and EU reach deal on Northern Ireland border checks

Quote

The UK and EU have reached agreement on how rules in the withdrawal agreement will be implemented, particularly in relation to Northern Ireland.

The government says an agreement in principle has been found for issues including border control posts and the supply of medicines.

The government says it will now withdraw controversial clauses in the Internal Market Bill.

However, negotiations to reach a post-Brexit trade deal are still ongoing.

The details of the agreement have not been published but are expected to be rubber stamped in the coming days.

I wonder how much effect the now to be withdrawn 'we are going to break international treaties' clauses have had in undermining trust in the UK for future trade negotiations?

[tinfoilhat]

5 minutes ago, West 77 said:

It would make sense for German motor manufactures to pay any tariffs that arise from no trade agreement after 31st December to encourage much needed business.  A trade agreement will happen anyway but VW's  offer won't do their business and valuable sales to the UK any harm before December 31st.

So take a 10% hit on every car they sell? What percentage profit do you think they make per car? It's alright offering it as part of 3 week sale but permanently? I doubt it!

[tinfoilhat]

2 minutes ago, West 77 said:

I didn't say permanently.  

But after January.  How long should they sell cars at - presumably - a loss for?

[tinfoilhat]

12 minutes ago, West 77 said:

I doubt they would be selling at a loss. If a German car manufacturer have large numbers of right hand drive cars already made and ready for exporting in January it would make commercial sense to pay tariffs in order to encourage UK sales. The Coronavirus will have effected exports to the UK this year and just breaking even on car sales helps to keep people in jobs in the short term.

 

They're all made to order so they won't have any unsold right hand drive cars sitting around , unless dealerships and car supermarkets have bought a load preregistered ones (same for most companies now i think) and I suspect they've bought as many as they're going to.

 

Try and find a show Richard hammond did on the VW factory, very interesting.