Consequences Of Brexit [Part 9] Read First Post Before Posting

[m williamson]

30 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

For goodness sake stop trying to justify republican atrocities by highlighting loyalist crimes.

Dreadful crimes were committed but look at the stats.

 

Yes they were, you should try to stop pointing the finger in one direction. 

The thing to bear in mind is that  British state forces and the ' loyalist ' terrorists they colluded with were doing what they did in order to continue the interference of another country in Irelands affairs. It had been made perfectly clear in the election of 1918 that the majority of people in Ireland wanted independence. Whether you accept it or not the PIRA believed they were fighting for the freedom of their country from foreign interference.

Westminster chose not to honour that wish and that led to the War of Independence and the partitioning of an ancient nation against the wishes of the majority. Place responsibility where it belongs, not with the ordinary people of either country but with the self serving duplicitous politicians.

No one came out of that conflict covered in glory, it was a nasty obscenity of a conflict, my sympathy is with the innocent civilians of all sides who were just trying to live their lives in peace.

[harvey19]

5 minutes ago, m williamson said:

Your reply at # 6720 did not deal with it. In fact your reply made little sense. The point was put to you that the people I listed were all born somewhere other than the country and nationality they are accepted as belonging to. Do you therefore accept that a birth certificate does not tell the full story as you appeared to suggest?

 

By the logic used in your ' no idea what life was like ' comment presumably you discount any historical information unless the person imparting it was actually present when the event(s) took place?

I have worked with ex soldiers who served in Northern Ireland, had an interesting conversation with John Stalker a number of years ago and because of my Irish connection took an interest in what was going on during the period. I don't profess to know everything about it but I do know the basics and the history leading up to it.

The Catholic community were pleased to see the original arrival of the troops because the ' loyalists ' who began the violence were deliberately targeting Catholic civilians.

 

As far as who committed the atrocities is concerned studies have been done on what happened. http://eprints.lse.ac.uk/100102/1/Hughes_and_Ahmadov_accepted_2019_Irish_Political_Studies._complete_manuscript.civilian_victimisation.pdf

LSE study, if you want to save time scroll down to page 15 and start reading at the heading Northern Ireland's " Long War "

 

 

You can talk to people and read history to get an overview but if you have not experienced the fear,  death and intimidation you will never have the same outlook as those who have done so.

The crimes committed are not to be excused or the causes excuse those crimes.

Your experiences in S. Ireland have no comparison at all with peoples lives in some areas during the troubles.

I would urge you once again to read with an open mind about the atrocities which happened and then you may realise how blinkered it is to just look at the actions of one side.

 

But as Organgrinder says this thread is about Brexit and so I will focus on that  topic. 

 

[m williamson]

31 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

You can talk to people and read history to get an overview but if you have not experienced the fear,  death and intimidation you will never have the same outlook as those who have done so.

The crimes committed are not to be excused or the causes excuse those crimes.

Your experiences in S. Ireland have no comparison at all with peoples lives in some areas during the troubles.

I would urge you once again to read with an open mind about the atrocities which happened and then you may realise how blinkered it is to just look at the actions of one side.

 

But as Organgrinder says this thread is about Brexit and so I will focus on that  topic. 

 

You are someone who makes too many assumptions about people, but as you say the thread is supposed to be about Brexit.

 

So back on track, how do you think it's going for the country so far?

[harvey19]

6 minutes ago, m williamson said:

You are someone who makes too many assumptions about people, but as you say the thread is supposed to be about Brexit.

 

So back on track, how do you think it's going for the country so far?

OK from my personal viewpoint.

The wider country position seems to be fluid.

[m williamson]

18 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

OK from my personal viewpoint.

The wider country position seems to be fluid.

The increase in prices caused by our inflation rate being higher than virtually all EU countries -  according to the House of Commons Library - is a problem for virtually everyone  https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9428/#:~:text=In July 2023%2C the UK's,and the US (1.4%).

 

But life goes on.

[harvey19]

31 minutes ago, m williamson said:

The increase in prices caused by our inflation rate being higher than virtually all EU countries -  according to the House of Commons Library - is a problem for virtually everyone  https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9428/#:~:text=In July 2023%2C the UK's,and the US (1.4%).

 

But life goes on.

We are enjoying life.

 

Yesterday I went to a 1940s weekend at Grassington. Plenty of singing and dancing in the street. Some people get in the atmosphere by dressing up (not me )    There is one at Pickering next month which unfortunately I can not get to.

I would recommend a visit, some people stay overnight and enjoy the evening entertainment.

 

Ups strayed off Brexit again !

[m williamson]

5 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

We are enjoying life.

 

Yesterday I went to a 1940s weekend at Grassington. Plenty of singing and dancing in the street. Some people get in the atmosphere by dressing up (not me )    There is one at Pickering next month which unfortunately I can not get to.

I would recommend a visit, some people stay overnight and enjoy the evening entertainment.

 

Ups strayed off Brexit again !

My wife and I love the Dales, beautiful part of the country. We took a couple of friends who were Londoners ( We're very broadminded ) there a few years ago and they were amazed, they had no idea it existed. We love the Lake district, the Derbyshire Dales and Northumberland as well.

Life's not so bad when we can still enjoy those places. However, we also love Italy, Spain, France. the Balearic's. Croatia, Turkey, Greece and numerous other places we've visited over the years and are now having to think long and hard about whether or not we should spend the money as a result of the impact of Brexit. Booked for Spain next year 😎.

There's no getting away from it, it's not worked out as the fanatic Brexiteers thought it would. That fact needs to be acknowledged and reality faced up to.

Re-join the Single Market. Norway isn't in the EU, it has a sovereign wealth fund of  $1.4 Trillion and yet it pays to be in the Single Market.

 

 

 

[harvey19]

32 minutes ago, m williamson said:

My wife and I love the Dales, beautiful part of the country. We took a couple of friends who were Londoners ( We're very broadminded ) there a few years ago and they were amazed, they had no idea it existed. We love the Lake district, the Derbyshire Dales and Northumberland as well.

Life's not so bad when we can still enjoy those places. However, we also love Italy, Spain, France. the Balearic's. Croatia, Turkey, Greece and numerous other places we've visited over the years and are now having to think long and hard about whether or not we should spend the money as a result of the impact of Brexit. Booked for Spain next year 😎.

There's no getting away from it, it's not worked out as the fanatic Brexiteers thought it would. That fact needs to be acknowledged and reality faced up to.

Re-join the Single Market. Norway isn't in the EU, it has a sovereign wealth fund of  $1.4 Trillion and yet it pays to be in the Single Market.

 

 

 

I am disgusted at some of the results of Brexit but still think it was the right thing to do.

A few years ago we went to China and Hong Kong. It was an amazing holiday experience which I would recommend.

We enjoyed Malta also but from talking to friends who have visited it is a place you love or hate. There is a WW2 graveyard there where a battery of my fathers regimental colleagues are buried.

I've been to Denmark and Sweden but not Norway. Whilst walking up a street in Malmo, Sweden I saw Man. Utd. for the cup written in the grime on the window.

[Axe]

13 hours ago, m williamson said:

My wife and I love the Dales, beautiful part of the country. We took a couple of friends who were Londoners ( We're very broadminded ) there a few years ago and they were amazed, they had no idea it existed. We love the Lake district, the Derbyshire Dales and Northumberland as well.

Life's not so bad when we can still enjoy those places. However, we also love Italy, Spain, France. the Balearic's. Croatia, Turkey, Greece and numerous other places we've visited over the years and are now having to think long and hard about whether or not we should spend the money as a result of the impact of Brexit. Booked for Spain next year 😎.

There's no getting away from it, it's not worked out as the fanatic Brexiteers thought it would. That fact needs to be acknowledged and reality faced up to.

Re-join the Single Market. Norway isn't in the EU, it has a sovereign wealth fund of  $1.4 Trillion and yet it pays to be in the Single Market.

 

 

 

We had a referendum campaign in which it was made perfectly clear if the UK voted to leave the EU then the UK would also leave the single market.  The UK is not Noway or the Republic of Ireland who were bullied into having another referendum by the EU.  Time to move on or move to a country that is in the single market.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Axe said:

We had a referendum campaign in which it was made perfectly clear if the UK voted to leave the EU then the UK would also leave the single market.  The UK is not Noway or the Republic of Ireland who were bullied into having another referendum by the EU.  Time to move on or move to a country that is in the single market.

Time for you to accept that other people have their views too.

Of course,  your difficulty is that about 95% of those views are opposite to those which you express,  although you should be used to being in the minority.

Time then,  for people to say or do, exactly as they please and ignore your authoritarian views.

How are silly Sunak's  pledges coming along ?????????