Consequences Of Brexit [Part 9] Read First Post Before Posting

[m williamson]

2 hours ago, Axe said:

When MPs voted in favour of triggering Article50 they did so in the knowledge that leaving the EU without a deal was the default legal option.

Only a fool would take the option of walking away from any deal off the table.  

 

More nonsense.  It was parliament who gave approval to hold the EU referendum.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-33067157

Only a complete moron would walk away with no deal when that would cause serious damage to their country's interests.  As the former Governor of the Bank of England said " Those with little experience in the private sector, life long politicians masquerading as free marketeers, grossly undervalue the importance of mission, of institutions and of discipline to a strong economy. "

The politicians chosen to negotiate with the EU were less than useless,  David Davis and David Frost have no experience of business and were completely out of their depth. 

 

Business is vital to the country's welfare and business needs agreements in place so that it can operate day to day and plan for the future. What was that Johnson said about business? 

We've had total self serving incompetents running the country for over a decade now. The UK has had 5 Prime Ministers in 6 years and had 4 Chancellors of the Exchequer in 4 months. It's complete chaos and we're a laughing stock.

Anyone who still supports that malignant shower is a fool and has no thought for the county's future.

 

I don't have much faith in Starmer and Labour, but the Tory's have to lose the next election, otherwise it will be proof that the electorate accept incompetent, self serving corrupt politicians and they will take even more advantage of their positions than they already have.

 

[harvey19]

8 minutes ago, m williamson said:

Only a complete moron would walk away with no deal when that would cause serious damage to their country's interests.  As the former Governor of the Bank of England said " Those with little experience in the private sector, life long politicians masquerading as free marketeers, grossly undervalue the importance of mission, of institutions and of discipline to a strong economy. "

The politicians chosen to negotiate with the EU were less than useless,  David Davis and David Frost have no experience of business and were completely out of their depth. 

 

Business is vital to the country's welfare and business needs agreements in place so that it can operate day to day and plan for the future. What was that Johnson said about business? 

We've had total self serving incompetents running the country for over a decade now. The UK has had 5 Prime Ministers in 6 years and had 4 Chancellors of the Exchequer in 4 months. It's complete chaos and we're a laughing stock.

Anyone who still supports that malignant shower is a fool and has no thought for the county's future.

 

I don't have much faith in Starmer and Labour, but the Tory's have to lose the next election, otherwise it will be proof that the electorate accept incompetent, self serving corrupt politicians and they will take even more advantage of their positions than they already have.

 

What is the alternative ?

[Axe]

32 minutes ago, m williamson said:

Only a complete moron would walk away with no deal when that would cause serious damage to their country's interests.  As the former Governor of the Bank of England said " Those with little experience in the private sector, life long politicians masquerading as free marketeers, grossly undervalue the importance of mission, of institutions and of discipline to a strong economy. "

The politicians chosen to negotiate with the EU were less than useless,  David Davis and David Frost have no experience of business and were completely out of their depth. 

 

Business is vital to the country's welfare and business needs agreements in place so that it can operate day to day and plan for the future. What was that Johnson said about business? 

We've had total self serving incompetents running the country for over a decade now. The UK has had 5 Prime Ministers in 6 years and had 4 Chancellors of the Exchequer in 4 months. It's complete chaos and we're a laughing stock.

Anyone who still supports that malignant shower is a fool and has no thought for the county's future.

 

I don't have much faith in Starmer and Labour, but the Tory's have to lose the next election, otherwise it will be proof that the electorate accept incompetent, self serving corrupt politicians and they will take even more advantage of their positions than they already have.

 

You clearly are not very bright.  Removing the option of walking away from a deal weakens a negotiating position.  The behaviour of parliament strengthened the EU's negotiating position.  A no deal was never going to happen because the EU would have offered to renegotiate rather than trade with UK on WTO terms.  Boris Johnson did a fantastic job getting the EU to open up the withdrawal agreement when he hand his hands tied behind his back due to the Benn Act.

[m williamson]

23 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

What is the alternative ?

Alternative to what?

To the disgraced Tory party, a different party elected next election, to the Brexit debacle, rejoin the Single Market.

 

The first should happen, unless the country has actually gone mad, the second is doubtful because although it's the logical, sensible thing to do and would solve a lot of problems politicians are more interested in protecting their livelihood than what's best for the country.

[harvey19]

28 minutes ago, m williamson said:

Alternative to what?

To the disgraced Tory party, a different party elected next election, to the Brexit debacle, rejoin the Single Market.

 

The first should happen, unless the country has actually gone mad, the second is doubtful because although it's the logical, sensible thing to do and would solve a lot of problems politicians are more interested in protecting their livelihood than what's best for the country.

What is the alternative  to Conservative or Labour in realistic terms.

I think the Conservatives would win regardless.

[m williamson]

17 minutes ago, Axe said:

You clearly are not very bright.  Removing the option of walking away from a deal weakens a negotiating position.  The behaviour of parliament strengthened the EU's negotiating position.  A no deal was never going to happen because the EU would have offered to renegotiate rather than trade with UK on WTO terms.  Boris Johnson did a fantastic job getting the EU to open up the withdrawal agreement when he hand his hands tied behind his back due to the Benn Act.

No mate you're the one that has little grasp on reality. You may say that you'll walk away in order to instill some doubt in the mind of the opposition negotiators but if walking away would seriously harm your interest you would be a moron to do it.

The problem with the Brexit negotiation was that the EU negotiators were far more experienced and knowledgeable than the the untrained buffoons we had negotiating for us.

The other problem was that the EU knew exactly what would happen if we were daft enough to walk away and knew they were in the strongest position.

They'd listened to all our BS about " They need us more than we need them " and " We'll have our cake and eat it " and they knew full well it was all  bluff. And a counter productive embarrassing one at that, made us look weak.

 

Before starting my own business I worked for years as Northern Regional Operations Manager for a national PLC which was expanding by acquisition.

The regional managers were tasked with identifying suitable companies to purchase in our regions. I recommended companies in Newcastle, York , Hull and Manchester and made the first approach to them.

As operation managers we were familiar with all of the company activities from sales to installation to maintenance and emergency 24 hour breakdown response.

Therefore we sat in and took part in the negotiations, and in order to assist us in that particular job we all received negotiation training from experts in the field.

There are basics that apply to all negotiations no matter what the size of the deal is.  You treat the opposition with respect and manners, you don't insult them, you don't come the Billy Big Lad " we're so much bigger and richer than you, you'll just have to accept our offer "

The best deals suit both parties and a bit of compromise from both is sometimes required.

 

Our negotiators broke every rule in the book through sheer arrogance. Johnson used the DUP and then threw them under the bus when it suited. Totally their own fault, it was bleeding obvious that a border in the Irish sea was the only one that could work both practically and  the only one that wouldn't damage the GFA and annoy the Americans.

 

[m williamson]

2 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

What is the alternative  to Conservative or Labour in realistic terms.

I think the Conservatives would win regardless.

If the Tory's win the next election this country will deserve everything it gets. Contracts worth multi millions handed out to companies with no experience in producing the items required. A Ferry contract for a company with no boats. Elevation to the Lords for a Russian who's father was a KGB man.

 

Don't get me wrong I don't think that Labours record is exactly spotless when it comes to dodgy dealings, but to simply shrug our shoulders and re-elect the very people that have been involved in all this recent chicanery is simply saying carry on, no problem .

If we do that it will be similar to America electing Trump again, the international contempt will be immense.

 

 

 

https://committees.parliament.uk/committee/127/public-accounts-committee/news/171306/4-billion-of-unusable-ppe-bought-in-first-year-of-pandemic-will-be-burnt-to-generate-power/

 

https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/dark-money-investigations/want-a-seat-in-the-house-of-lords-be-tory-treasurer-and-donate-3m/

 

https://www.politico.eu/article/queen-asked-block-uk-house-lords-place-media-ma-evgeny-lebedev/

 

Ideally the Liberals would get in but they haven't got a chance have they?

[harvey19]

10 minutes ago, m williamson said:

If the Tory's win the next election this country will deserve everything it gets. Contracts worth multi millions handed out to companies with no experience in producing the items required. A Ferry contract for a company with no boats. Elevation to the Lords for a Russian who's father was a KGB man.

 

Don't get me wrong I don't think that Labours record is exactly spotless when it comes to dodgy dealings, but to simply shrug our shoulders and re-elect the very people that have been involved in all this recent chicanery is simply saying carry on, no problem .

If we do that it will be similar to America electing Trump again, the international contempt will be immense.

 

 

 

https://committees.parliament.uk/committee/127/public-accounts-committee/news/171306/4-billion-of-unusable-ppe-bought-in-first-year-of-pandemic-will-be-burnt-to-generate-power/

 

https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/dark-money-investigations/want-a-seat-in-the-house-of-lords-be-tory-treasurer-and-donate-3m/

 

https://www.politico.eu/article/queen-asked-block-uk-house-lords-place-media-ma-evgeny-lebedev/

 

Ideally the Liberals would get in but they haven't got a chance have they?

I think the Liberals are a spent force therefore................

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

What is the alternative  to Conservative or Labour in realistic terms.

I think the Conservatives would win regardless.

If the Tories won the next election, I'm very sure they would soon regret it.

There is a hell of a lot of  shi  mess to clear up for the next incumbents and it's a lot  harder if you are the ones who made it in the first place.

Sunak's got around a year to bumble his way through yet and plenty of chance to land in even more trouble. 

I predict a Labour + Lib Dem coalition  but I would enjoy the laugh if the Tories managed to win because their majority would be tiny and they've shown they  can't do the job with a large one.

 

[m williamson]

3 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

I think the Liberals are a spent force therefore................

Unfortunately I agree.

Pity, because if they did get elected it would give the other two parties the kick up the backside they both richly deserve.