tinfoilhat Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 6 minutes ago, apelike said: As said before, anyone can post stuff on twitter without having to give out the source of that information. I now wonder where he gets his information from as it seems suspect. BTW, I am annoyed at this government as it was blindingly obvious that Track and Trace would not be successful unless it was compulsory for all regardless of who got the contract. At the cost, what, £22bn, if have thought it would be perfect. We're talking about the possibility of fraud over £500 while ignoring the really big score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baron99 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 27 minutes ago, Mister M said: Stephen Reicher on Twitter: "New York. Isolation rate: 95-97%. Support: money, hotel accommodation, food, other essential goods, regular contact. UK. Isolation rate: 11-23%. Support: money (possibly, for a few, hard to access). See the difference? We need supported isolation. And we need it now." / Twitter of Independent Sage I don't dispute that a few irresponsible people may try and get the £500, but I don't believe that the vast majority of people will deliberately infect themselves with Covid to get that money, or to get to stay in a quarantine hotel. There maybe evidence of this in New York, and if, there is even a whiff of scrounging behaviour, then I'm sure if the American version of the Daily Mail would be all over it like a rash. I also agree that statutory sick pay should be raised so that working people can afford to self isolate if they get the virus. I suppose ultimately it depends on people's priorities: do everything possible to try to curb infection rates; or feel hard done by because a small minority of people would be so stupid as to willingly put their lives in danger, contract the virus so they could get some 'free money'. We know that the new strain of the virus is more transmissible, yet the latest lockdown rules are much more lax. It just doesn't make any sense whatsoever. I'm all in favour of using the stick where necessary, whether that's fines & threats of a criminal record. I would also like to ask is are people just as angry at multi million pound contracts to friends of the government for providing inadequate services (Test & Trace?), as they are with some dim window licker desperate enough to try to get Covid so they can claim £500? I'm all for the Australian style quarantining of new arrivals to the UK in hotels, accompanied by Australia heavy penalties. It much easier to control a locked down hotel then have people tell the authorities that they are staying at a private residential address & have the police look in on someone, on the off chance of catching them out. Once again, any scheme requires enforcement & there just isn't the manpower available to keep check on the tens of thousands of UK nationals currently showing positive tests. And what about, albeit a small number who test positive for a second time? Do we pay them another £500? I've not taken a test so I don't know what information you have to give? Could someone take a number of test over a period of time, giving false information & receive multiple payments? As I stated earlier, the fraud in the furlough scheme is estimated to run to at least £3 billion. Unless the whole scheme could be properly policed & enforcement made, it would never work & when you read the following that police have had to attend to a number of parties in the Kensington area of London, it doesn't give me much faith that it would? https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-55778930 Latest incident, 200 people at a party, which police tried to break up, 2 officers injured, no arrests made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister M Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Baron99 said: I'm all for the Australian style quarantining of new arrivals to the UK in hotels, accompanied by Australia heavy penalties. It much easier to control a locked down hotel then have people tell the authorities that they are staying at a private residential address & have the police look in on someone, on the off chance of catching them out. Once again, any scheme requires enforcement & there just isn't the manpower available to keep check on the tens of thousands of UK nationals currently showing positive tests. And what about, albeit a small number who test positive for a second time? Do we pay them another £500? I've not taken a test so I don't know what information you have to give? Could someone take a number of test over a period of time, giving false information & receive multiple payments? As I stated earlier, the fraud in the furlough scheme is estimated to run to at least £3 billion. Unless the whole scheme could be properly policed & enforcement made, it would never work & when you read the following that police have had to attend to a number of parties in the Kensington area of London, it doesn't give me much faith that it would? https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-55778930 Latest incident, 200 people at a party, which police tried to break up, 2 officers injured, no arrests made. I agree with you about Australian style quarantining of new arrivals to the UK in hotels, accompanied by Australia heavy penalties. I do know other countries which have successfully managed the virus have marshalled their resources into using hotels which infected people are catered for, but CANNOT leave for 2 weeks. If other countries can do it why can't we? In fact didn't the UK do that right at the beginning of the lockdown where people were quarantined on an ocean liner? There is fraud in the furlough system, and I sincerely hope that those caught will be named, shamed and punished. I would think that for working people then a raised level of statutory sick pay would mean that covers them for the period of isolation. It doesn't even have to be £500 for those not working, enough to tide them over. I've put forward a few suggestions. As a country we're not helpless. We created the NHS out of the ashes of WW2, and sent rockets to the moon - I think as a country we can do a bit better than being known for one of the worst performing countries in terms of death rates from this wretched virus, Edited January 23, 2021 by Mister M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 20 minutes ago, Baron99 said: I'm all for the Australian style quarantining of new arrivals to the UK in hotels, accompanied by Australia heavy penalties. It much easier to control a locked down hotel then have people tell the authorities that they are staying at a private residential address & have the police look in on someone, on the off chance of catching them out. Once again, any scheme requires enforcement & there just isn't the manpower available to keep check on the tens of thousands of UK nationals currently showing positive tests. And what about, albeit a small number who test positive for a second time? Do we pay them another £500? I've not taken a test so I don't know what information you have to give? Could someone take a number of test over a period of time, giving false information & receive multiple payments? As I stated earlier, the fraud in the furlough scheme is estimated to run to at least £3 billion. Unless the whole scheme could be properly policed & enforcement made, it would never work & when you read the following that police have had to attend to a number of parties in the Kensington area of London, it doesn't give me much faith that it would? https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-55778930 Latest incident, 200 people at a party, which police tried to break up, 2 officers injured, no arrests made. I'd be staggered if the government knew where travellers who arrived last week are now, and where they've been for the last week. I've had a quick look at the arrivals page on Heathrow website - Paris, Hong Kong, doha, dubai - all probably safer countries than us at this point - but we can lock down as tight as we like but its another door we're still leaving open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiffRaff Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 14 minutes ago, Mister M said: I agree with you about Australian style quarantining of new arrivals to the UK in hotels, accompanied by Australia heavy penalties. I do know other countries which have successfully managed the virus have marshalled their resources into using hotels which infected people are catered for, but CANNOT leave for 2 weeks. If other countries can do it why can't we? In fact didn't the UK do that right at the beginning of the lockdown where people were quarantined on an ocean liner? There is fraud in the furlough system, and I sincerely hope that those caught will be named, shamed and punished. I would think that for working people then a raised level of statutory sick pay would mean that covers them for the period of isolation. It doesn't even have to be £500 for those not working, enough to tide them over. I've put forward a few suggestions. As a country we're not helpless. We created the NHS out of the ashes of WW2, and sent rockets to the moon - I think as a country we can do a bit better than being known for one of the worst performing countries in terms of death rates from this wretched virus, Apparently one of the reasons is insurance : the hotels can't get cover. Another is staff. I wouldn't fancy working in one if all the residents had proved positive.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baron99 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 17 minutes ago, tinfoilhat said: I'd be staggered if the government knew where travellers who arrived last week are now, and where they've been for the last week. I've had a quick look at the arrivals page on Heathrow website - Paris, Hong Kong, doha, dubai - all probably safer countries than us at this point - but we can lock down as tight as we like but its another door we're still leaving open. Passengers are required to fill in passenger locator form before they leave their departure country. Once again, there's a reliance on travellers' honesty of providing genuine address details? Even then, there is little in the way of checking the millions of travellers who have arrived (& probably left again?), & no follow up when the authorities can't find them. https://news.sky.com/story/amp/covid-19-no-fines-issued-for-over-1-400-travellers-who-may-have-ignored-coronavirus-quarantine-rules-12147327#aoh=16114270463826&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&_tf=From %1%24s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 2 hours ago, Baron99 said: Passengers are required to fill in passenger locator form before they leave their departure country. Once again, there's a reliance on travellers' honesty of providing genuine address details? Even then, there is little in the way of checking the millions of travellers who have arrived (& probably left again?), & no follow up when the authorities can't find them. https://news.sky.com/story/amp/covid-19-no-fines-issued-for-over-1-400-travellers-who-may-have-ignored-coronavirus-quarantine-rules-12147327#aoh=16114270463826&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&_tf=From %1%24s Wow, foolproof! Thats £22bn well spent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victor Meldrew Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 4 hours ago, El Cid said: My 93 yr old relative hasnt had his vaccination yet. The doctors practice told him they dont have enough supply. I am hoping that is just an excuse, although they should really be honest. Its a nurse that will be coming to his house, so that could mean things take longer. That's ridiculous surely? Two of my relatives in their 80's (in Stoke) have had their Pfizer jabs, both the first & the second ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister M Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Scenes of large queues at Heathrow airport have emerged for a second day, sparking concerns over the lack of social distancing. ITV News on Twitter: "Scenes of large queues at Heathrow airport have emerged for a second day, sparking concerns over the lack of social distancing. https://t.co/LBV2XxqLk4" / Twitter I thought one of the key reasons for Brexit was to control our borders. Seems that the Government are unable to even get that right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Cid Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 19 minutes ago, Victor Meldrew said: That's ridiculous surely? Two of my relatives in their 80's (in Stoke) have had their Pfizer jabs, both the first & the second ones. It is, but I believe the old people in care homes have not been done yet. But the Government are not releasing information. The tactics of our mini-Trump! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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