South Yorkshire Bus Service Needs Improvement

[RollingJ]

1 minute ago, hello1964 said:

 https://nowthenmagazine.com/articles/mayor-coppard-ramps-up-fair-funding-campaign-for-south-yorkshires-buses

Go on Oli....  

Maybe if he hadn't been so greedy...

[Irene Swaine]

5 minutes ago, RollingJ said:

From my knowledge, First Sheffield train drivers on a number of routes, to, as you say, cover for sickness/holidays &c, but they can and do, move them around. Can't see the relevance of service 18 in this 'discussion', though.

Yes, it's quite common in the industry to have the most training on allocated routes and some basic training on other routes just in case. I was trained for a week on London routes but also did 2 days on Peterborough - Liverpools. 

 

Route 18 is a prime example of why bus drivers usually sign one or two specific routes. It goes around many estates and side roads, difficult to remember every single turn.

[hello1964]

https://www.thestar.co.uk/news/sheffield-buses-first-apologises-over-huge-delays-to-bus-services-across-sheffield-and-rotherham-meadowhall-4439108

[RollingJ]

1 minute ago, Irene Swaine said:

Yes, it's quite common in the industry to have the most training on allocated routes and some basic training on other routes just in case. I was trained for a week on London routes but also did 2 days on Peterborough - Liverpools. 

 

Route 18 is a prime example of why bus drivers usually sign one or two specific routes. It goes around many estates and side roads, difficult to remember every single turn.

I have a feeling buses don't run on railtrack.

1 minute ago, hello1964 said:

https://www.thestar.co.uk/news/sheffield-buses-first-apologises-over-huge-delays-to-bus-services-across-sheffield-and-rotherham-meadowhall-4439108

As stated in the article - none of this could reasonably be attributed to the operators.

[Irene Swaine]

10 minutes ago, hello1964 said:

 https://nowthenmagazine.com/articles/mayor-coppard-ramps-up-fair-funding-campaign-for-south-yorkshires-buses

Go on Oli....  

It is disgusting that South Yorkshire got no funding when West Midlands and Greater Manchester got over £70 million each. 

 

I don't agree with their idea of franchising and a London style scheme though. After the buses were deregulated, the passenger benefited from an exemplary service network of different operators, running to all places imaginable at high frequencies. That was made possible by the deregulation. The article says that usage of buses in London has increased over the years while it has decreased elsewhere in the country, but fails to acknowledge that London has seen the introduction of congestion charges and ULEZ zones over recent years, combined with a high level of permit parking, making car travel undesirable. 

 

I do think that companies like South Pennine and Hulley's could be the saviours of the bus system in Sheffield. South Pennine have recently acquired land at Brightside for a depot, so will be looking to expand their network. Routes such as the 61/62 would be ideal for them, as I doubt Stagecoach will want to keep running it when the cash incentives run out. Hulley's have really made an effort in recent years, in part with the Derbyshire Bus Improvement funding to introduce new routes to get customers back on to buses but they need to advertise them better. A selection of small "feeder" buses that connect areas off the beaten tracks to the flagship routes would get more bums on seats. For example, buses running from Killamarsh, Renishaw, Plumbley and Eckington to Halfway Park & Ride to connect with the 120.

 

 

[Andy C]

Simple fact is we cannot have punctual and reliable bus services if the roads the buses run on are too congested, this failure of publicly controlled infrastructure is nothing the bus operators can do anything about, the council need to address this.

[Andy C]

9 minutes ago, Irene Swaine said:

It is disgusting that South Yorkshire got no funding when West Midlands and Greater Manchester got over £70 million each. 

 

I don't agree with their idea of franchising and a London style scheme though. After the buses were deregulated, the passenger benefited from an exemplary service network of different operators, running to all places imaginable at high frequencies. That was made possible by the deregulation. The article says that usage of buses in London has increased over the years while it has decreased elsewhere in the country, but fails to acknowledge that London has seen the introduction of congestion charges and ULEZ zones over recent years, combined with a high level of permit parking, making car travel undesirable. 

 

I do think that companies like South Pennine and Hulley's could be the saviours of the bus system in Sheffield. South Pennine have recently acquired land at Brightside for a depot, so will be looking to expand their network. Routes such as the 61/62 would be ideal for them, as I doubt Stagecoach will want to keep running it when the cash incentives run out. Hulley's have really made an effort in recent years, in part with the Derbyshire Bus Improvement funding to introduce new routes to get customers back on to buses but they need to advertise them better. A selection of small "feeder" buses that connect areas off the beaten tracks to the flagship routes would get more bums on seats. For example, buses running from Killamarsh, Renishaw, Plumbley and Eckington to Halfway Park & Ride to connect with the 120.

 

 

I'm not entirely sure the South Yorkshire Mayoral Combined Authority really bid for funding in the spirit of the Bus Service Improvement Plan (BSIP) scheme. It was for improvements to infrastructure and services that would grow patronage in a sustainable way, not to achieve political ambitions of subsidising fares or to prop up existing services where the budget is running out.

 

Sadly Hulleys is currently a disaster zone with huge lists of cancellations, in some case leaving rural communities cut off for days, this is a result of driver shortages and fleet issues. The whole industry is actually still suffering with staff shortages and dramatically increasing operating costs following a combination of Brexit, Covid and a government that has handled the economy badly. 

 

There seems to be rose tinted spectacles involved when comments are made about London. They do have good public transport down there but bus usage has been in decline since Boris Johnson was Mayor - he cut bus priority measures with the result that journey times and reliability has got much worse. TfL are also not exactly in a good place financially.

 

Over in Manchester hard lessons are already being learned with the franchised Bee Network with poor reliability due to traffic congestion and driver shortages resulting in more tax payers money being chucked in to increase resource - painting the buses yellow and having politicians specify the network doesn't solve such issues!

Edited December 19, 2023 by Andy C

[Irene Swaine]

2 minutes ago, Andy C said:

Sadly Hulleys is currently a disaster zone with huge lists of cancellations, in some case leaving rural communities cut off for days, this is a result of driver shortages and fleet issues.

Yes, it's important to note that not all of the obstacles are financial ones. The "lockdown" caused a change in behaviour of people, leading to more violence and abusive behaviour that makes bus driving seem less desirable. 

[Guest busdriver1]

I have to say that in the case of this drivers assault that the version from the Star is at odds with my own experience with that company. We had a few drivers who had to be kept away from certain areas or routes because of assaults and the company were very supportive of their staff in these situations offering counselling paid for by the company and in some cases transfers to other depots. Rotherham depot used to have a fair few drivers who had been transferred from Sheffield for just that reason, and, obviously when Rotherham closed most let the industry. I also think that the alleged cause of the issue has been miss-represented as to the best of my knowledge no instruction was given to refuse cash, just a request to passengers to avoid the use of it where possible.

 

Sadly there are some jobsworths and barrack room lawyers on bus companies and some of these chose to interpret things their way.

Edited December 19, 2023 by busdriver1

[Irene Swaine]

3 minutes ago, busdriver1 said:

I have to say that in the case of this drivers assault that the version from the Star is at odds with my own experience with that company. We had a few drivers who had to be kept away from certain areas or routes because of assaults and the company were very supportive of their staff in these situations offering counselling paid for by the company and in some cases transfers to other depots. I also think that the alleged cause of the issue has been represented as to the best of my knowledge no instruction was given to refuse cash, just a request to passengers to avoid the use of it where possible. Sadly there are some jobsworths and barrack room lawyers on bus companies and some of these chose to interpret things their way.

Thank you for clarifying this. It's good to see that cash WAS being accepted at the time. For me, it puts things in to a different perspective. Mr Nelson's child was also poorly at the time, which of course is stressful and worrying. I had. a First Bus driver tell me I would be arrested for not wearing a mask on my face if a policeman got on the bus. Some of the drivers seemed to revel in the whole coronavirus mask/distancing "rules". I made an official complaint about said driver and got an apology. All buses should accept cash and as I said earlier, this is protected in law. It's abhorrent that The Star and Yorkshire Post did not contact First for their right to reply. First have always seemed a good employer to me. My colleagues who worked as hosts on the TransPennine Express contract were certainly well looked after by First.