South Yorkshire Bus Service Needs Improvement

[RollingJ]

Just now, BigAl1 said:

sincere apologies

 

i was forgetting that facts should not get in the way of a good argument but I was multi tasking and looking for the 52A stop whilst replying

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[Guest busdriver1]

The reluctance of some to even hint at their qualifications etc and the sparing details given COULD be explained as follows.

 

I worked in the transport industry - I worked for a day as a caterer on trains but could not cut it.

I have a diploma in business studies - I got a 4th grade pass in catering management.

 

Both would be true but factually irrelevant to the discussion.

 

My point here is that the claims made are irrelevant without any reference to their connection with the industry. 

 

Yes lots of bus companies take on graduates to train for management positions but this section of the Bus company has the highest failure rate of all recruitment areas in the bus industry.

[BigAl1]

14 minutes ago, busdriver1 said:

The reluctance of some to even hint at their qualifications etc and the sparing details given COULD be explained as follows.

 

I worked in the transport industry - I worked for a day as a caterer on trains but could not cut it.

I have a diploma in business studies - I got a 4th grade pass in catering management.

 

Both would be true but factually irrelevant to the discussion.

 

My point here is that the claims made are irrelevant without any reference to their connection with the industry. 

 

Yes lots of bus companies take on graduates to train for management positions but this section of the Bus company has the highest failure rate of all recruitment areas in the bus industry.

I would have said the claims about qualifications  were on the whole irrelevant as I said earlier what matters once ON the career ladder is experience and knowledge as well as relevant skills. True if one has an Executive MBA a relevant post Grad qualification or some very specialised qualification that is a different matter.

 

Graduate training programmers as undertaken by many companies are an excellent learning process and indeed the very reason these course exist is that most graduates (and this is not a criticism) have the knowledge and expertise to hit the ground running.   Sad to hear the bus progammes are not a success

 

just re read this post from our friend who clearly believe that she is well informed because she has a diploma and shows us that she is completely unaware of the fact that the tram train carried around a million passengers in its first year (a fact that surprised me when I looked for FACTS I confess)

 

Uninformed? I have a Business Diploma. Any decision to keep the tram train would be a foolish one. I think you are talking tosh. The thread is about buses, buses which are being scaled back and withdrawn all together while the public purse is subsidising a frequent service to a run down retail park.

 

 

[Bargepole23]

35 minutes ago, LovePotion said:

Graduate means someone who has successfully completed a course of education, E.G. diploma.

 

It is irrelevant how many people used the tram train in its first year if you don't know where they were using it to. The fact is the majority of users don't go to Rotherham. Watch how many get off at Meadowhall. 

 

How often have you gotten on one of these things at Parkgate? It may have had a bunch of curious people trying it in the beginning, but the numbers are low now that the novelty has worn off. 

 

Even leaving the city centre of an evening, I notice these tram trains are emoty, never more than four passengers on them and that is before they get to Meadowhall. 

 

It is a sinking money pit. 

Nope. In the UK a graduate has been awarded a degree, not a diploma. 

[Annie Bynnol]

4 minutes ago, LovePotion said:

Graduate means someone who has successfully completed a course of education, E.G. diploma.

 

It is irrelevant how many people used the tram train in its first year if you don't know where they were using it to. The fact is the majority of users don't go to Rotherham. Watch how many get off at Meadowhall. 

 

How often have you gotten on one of these things at Parkgate? It may have had a bunch of curious people trying it in the beginning, but the numbers are low now that the novelty has worn off. 

 

Even leaving the city centre of an evening, I notice these tram trains are emoty, never more than four passengers on them and that is before they get to Meadowhall. 

 

It is a sinking money pit. 

'Graduate' and 'diploma' are too vague and has 'graduated' has taken on the American meaning.

A 'graduate' in England is associated with a University level education i.e. undergraduate, (graduand), graduate, post graduate and above.

It is common in the USA to associate 'graduate' with completion of High Schools,  Drama Schools etc. courses.

Sheffield College issues Diplomas at level 3 upward and Foundation Degrees at level 5. Students can then complete a Full Degree with a further course which is accredited by an higher awarding body such as Hallam University.

 

In England when someone  claims to have graduated from a specific university it actually means a standard of education has been reached and a Degree awarded. 

It would be unusual to claim to be a Graduate of  Sheffield College and I would have been very wary of someone who did unless they meant a Foundation Degrees or an accredited full degree.

 

 

 

 

[BigAl1]

7 hours ago, LovePotion said:

Graduate means someone who has successfully completed a course of education, E.G. diploma.

 

It is irrelevant how many people used the tram train in its first year if you don't know where they were using it to. The fact is the majority of users don't go to Rotherham. Watch how many get off at Meadowhall. 

 

How often have you gotten on one of these things at Parkgate? It may have had a bunch of curious people trying it in the beginning, but the numbers are low now that the novelty has worn off. 

 

Even leaving the city centre of an evening, I notice these tram trains are emoty, never more than four passengers on them and that is before they get to Meadowhall. 

 

It is a sinking money pit. 

OK so give me uptodate ridership numbers to support your argument FACTS please not the odd random sightings.

 

I went last week to Parkgate but did not count how many were on it but it was not empty true not full but then neither was the yellow tram I completed my journey on to middlewood 

 

Assuming, which is a big assumption I know, you have these numbers then one would need to look at the costs and revenue which no doubt you learnt all about at college . It sounds like a great idea to leave these expensive trams sitting and rotting in the depot. 
 

BTW i graduated from play school many years ago  but that did not make me a graduate in the accepted use of the word - unusual,it does not happen often,  but I agree with Annie 100% on this.

 

 

 

 

[Resident]

17 hours ago, LovePotion said:

I graduated from The Sheffield College. 

You don't get a diploma for graduating. You get a degree. 

You did not graduate. You passed your course, nothing more, nothing less.

 

17 hours ago, Annie Bynnol said:

It would be unusual to claim to be a Graduate of  Sheffield College and I would have been very wary of someone who did unless they meant a Foundation Degrees or an accredited full degree.

 

You can do degree course at Sheffield College but they're only HNC level, ie you study year one of a full degree. HNCs are gateways to getting into University when you didn't quite make the cut due to your A-level grades.

LP will have studied what I know as GNVQ, whatever they wanna call them these days. If you passed an advanced GNVQ with Distinction it was the equivalent to an A-level so not graduate level & neither is a HNC. 

[Annie Bynnol]

50 minutes ago, Resident said:

You can do degree course at Sheffield College but they're only HNC level, ie you study year one of a full degree. HNCs are gateways to getting into University when you didn't quite make the cut due to your A-level grades.

Yes- these are called Foundation Degrees. They have a large vocational component.

You can stay on at the College for another year and complete a Full Degree with honours.

These are accredited by Higher Education institutions like Hallam which share the fees with the College.

To do these courses you can apply through the student loan scheme and a disabled student grant if applicable

 

The College route is very much a recommended route for some, particularly those who may need a much higher level of continuing support which Universities do not provide.

A young man who left school with no useful GCSE's because of two types of learning difficulties completed his full degree and is now fully employed. Neither University in Sheffield could provide anywhere near the level of personal support needed and he would have found them overwhelming.

 

Without the help of Sheffield College it is very likely that he would have lived a life on state benefits and increasingly mentally challenging future- instead he is part of a team of an international company. The difference to the country coffers is around £10 000 a year. 

I would  encourage anybody in a similar situation to consider a similar route even though it might take years longer.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 9, 2022 by Annie Bynnol

[BigAl1]

34 minutes ago, Annie Bynnol said:

Yes- these are called Foundation Degrees. They have a large vocational component.

You can stay on at the College for another year and complete a Full Degree with honours.

These are accredited by Higher Education institutions like Hallam which share the fees with the College.

To do these courses you can apply through the student loan scheme and a disabled student grant if applicable

 

The College route is very much a recommended route for some, particularly those who may need a much higher level of continuing support which Universities do not provide.

A young man who left school with no useful GCSE's because of two types of learning difficulties completed his full degree and is now fully employed. Neither University in Sheffield could provide anywhere near the level of personal support needed and he would have found them overwhelming.

 

Without the help of Sheffield College it is very likely that he would have lived a life on state benefits and increasingly mentally challenging future- instead he is part of a team of an international company. The difference to the country coffers is around £10 000 a year. 

I would  encourage anybody in a similar situation to consider a similar route even though it might take years longer.

 

 

 

 

Colleges have a very valuable role in our education hierarchy and few would argue otherwise. Indeed many colleges these days work closely with their local university to provide pathways to higher education

[Annie Bynnol]

21 minutes ago, BigAl1 said:

Colleges have a very valuable role in our education hierarchy and few would argue otherwise. Indeed many colleges these days work closely with their local university to provide pathways to higher education

Forgot to mention that completing the full degree at Sheffield College saves thousands and that going to Hallam to do the extra final year for the honours degree  after completing the Foundation Degree, is usually not an option.