Has The Time Come To Replace The Welfare State With Universal Basic Income?

[El Cid]

1 hour ago, trastrick said:

Unfortunately you have to live in a world where intelligent people don't share you dismissive views on the subject.

 

Of course our friend Rishi, will be long gone by that time. 

 

There's no Santa Claus, no Easter Bunny, no tooth fairy, and no "free" lunch.

 

And the sooner folks face that stark reality the better off the world will be.

They already give people loads of money, tax credits, child benefit, bareavment benefit, pension credit, council tax support, free school meals, PIP, 45% off your right to buy home and contracts to millionaire friends.

People can now bring up children without a breadwinnner with the help of the state. But yet we still have people begging for money, foodbanks, charity shops and millions donated to charity.

 

Just look at the amount raised by Children in Need in 2020 was £41 million.

 

https://www.statista.com/topics/3781/charities-in-the-uk/

[trastrick]

On 01/06/2021 at 10:20, Ms Macbeth said:

Have you tried the public sector?  Sheffield city council's job adverts state:

 

'We are committed to fairness and social justice and welcome applications from everyone. We value our diverse workforce and aim to work together to make the most of our differences. Under the Disability Confident Scheme, disabled applicants, who meet the essential criteria of this job, are guaranteed an interview.'

 

I've worked for more than one council and other public sector bodies and I've always had colleagues with disabilities. 

Lol

 

"Under the Disability Confident Scheme, disabled applicants, who meet the essential criteria of this job, are guaranteed an interview.'"

 

Reminds me of the classic "you are pre approved for a Visa card."  When you say ok, they give you an application form.

 

Then you see the small print, "you are guaranteed a card, IF you meet our criteria".

[Anna B]

I think what people are missing on this thread is that in the future, jobs, especially reliable, full time  jobs, are going to be much harder to find. 

AI, automation and robotics are going to be doing a far wider range of occupations which will lead to the loss of whole swathes of employment. Output will continue and probably increase, so there will be less need for people to work. And it won't just be low grade repetitive jobs that will be affected.

 

This could be either the Utopian dream ticket if handled correctly, or a dystopian nightmare if not. We will have to relinquish our relationship with 'working for a living' as the only way to prosper, and replace it with something new.      

[trastrick]

8 hours ago, Anna B said:

I think what people are missing on this thread is that in the future, jobs, especially reliable, full time  jobs, are going to be much harder to find. 

AI, automation and robotics are going to be doing a far wider range of occupations which will lead to the loss of whole swathes of employment. Output will continue and probably increase, so there will be less need for people to work. And it won't just be low grade repetitive jobs that will be affected.

 

This could be either the Utopian dream ticket if handled correctly, or a dystopian nightmare if not. We will have to relinquish our relationship with 'working for a living' as the only way to prosper, and replace it with something new.      

Do you really believe that houses, electricity, water, transportation, food, household appliances, furniture, clothing, factories, hospitals, assembly lines, robots, are going to magically appear, without a human workforce?

 

And all those millions of government employees who regulate it all, can stay in bed?

 

That's just another "utopian" dream.

 

Society is more technologically advanced than ever before

 

And the world's workforce is at a record.

Edited June 12, 2021 by trastrick

[Anna B]

1 hour ago, trastrick said:

Do you really believe that houses, electricity, water, transportation, food, household appliances, furniture, clothing, factories, hospitals, assembly lines, robots, are going to magically appear, without a human workforce?

 

And all those millions of government employees who regulate it all, can stay in bed?

 

That's just another "utopian" dream.

 

Society is more technologically advanced than ever before

 

And the world's workforce is at a record.

No, of course not all jobs, but all the above require a manufacturing element which could be taken over by machines. 3D printed houses are already a fact in some parts of the world for instance. 

However some standardised letters are not only printed by machine but also composed and written entirely by AI as are some business reports. Things like accountancy and law are going to be heavily involved with AI, and hospitals are already full of advanced technology. Take a look at Jeff Bezos fully automated Amazon warehouse

 

https://uk.amazonfctours.com/virtualtours?utm_source=sem&utm_medium=g&utm_campaign=virtual_uk&utm_term=fctours

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/ajim.23037 

https://arekskuza.com/the-innovation-blog/amazon-and-artificial-intelligence-in-retail/

[trastrick]

16 minutes ago, Anna B said:

No, of course not all jobs, but all the above require a manufacturing element which could be taken over by machines. 3D printed houses are already a fact in some parts of the world for instance. 

However some standardised letters are not only printed by machine but also composed and written entirely by AI as are some business reports. Things like accountancy and law are going to be heavily involved with AI, and hospitals are already full of advanced technology. Take a look at Jeff Bezos fully automated Amazon warehouse

 

https://uk.amazonfctours.com/virtualtours?utm_source=sem&utm_medium=g&utm_campaign=virtual_uk&utm_term=fctours

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/ajim.23037 

https://arekskuza.com/the-innovation-blog/amazon-and-artificial-intelligence-in-retail/

The work force always re-arranges to market conditions and technological advances.

 

The automobile put the horse and carriage and buggy whip industry out of business, and spawned the giant auto industry. But the bicycle industry is growing every year.

 

The computer spawned the giant tech industry. 

 

The giant brewery conglomerates, should have provided enough mass produced beers but there is a greater demand for local craft beer than ever, and growing,

 

Some changes come reluctantly. Human nature.

 

Email should have put the Post Office and the Mailman out of business, and the growth of the TV industry  should have rendered the taxpayer funded BBC obsolete.

 

Maybe one day!

[Longcol]

On 12/06/2021 at 10:35, trastrick said:

Do you really believe that houses, electricity, water, transportation, food, household appliances, furniture, clothing, factories, hospitals, assembly lines, robots, are going to magically appear, without a human workforce?

 

And all those millions of government employees who regulate it all, can stay in bed?

 

That's just another "utopian" dream.

 

Society is more technologically advanced than ever before

 

And the world's workforce is at a record.

So is the worlds population - ain't that a coincidence?

[trastrick]

7 hours ago, Longcol said:

So is the worlds population - ain't that a coincidence?

No, 

 

More demand, more products produced, more workforce required.

 

Economics 101