The attitudes of British muslims and non-muslims toward each other

[Sweetcheeks]

true

 

but then you do get the educated ones...........who become the ringleaders of extreme groups and recruit the cannonfodder

Hi meltthebell, These "educated" ones are usually misfits who would love to obtain power but do not have the ability and use other people to do their dirty work.

[JoeP]

Although your group does sound reather inspirational Joe, I've had muslims make comments about me eating pork in the same vacinity, making comments about how its discussting and wrong, I don't tell them their food is discusting and wrong, I don't tell them that I think how they slaughter their animals is wrong

 

my opinion is split a little.

 

Maybe I just hang around with civilised people, and don't actually do or say anything provocative until I've actually established a relationship with people.

 

I wouldn't expect to get away with my behaviour with total strangers.

 

And I'm not convinced that telling a Muslim about how they slaughter animals would be that smart a move for me when I'm with Buddhists who would argue that 'my' way of slaughtering animals is equally abhorrent to them.

[melthebell]

 

And I'm not convinced that telling a Muslim about how they slaughter animals would be that smart a move for me when I'm with Buddhists who would argue that 'my' way of slaughtering animals is equally abhorrent to them.

 

thats the thing......everybody has to learn to be tolerent about everybodys way of doing things, if somebodys way of doing it is different to your beliefs you have to learn to shut the **** up....so to speak

[JoeP]

true

 

but then you do get the educated ones...........who become the ringleaders of extreme groups and recruit the cannonfodder

 

These are the ones who really **** me off - from any side of the argument - because they're intelligent and often wealthy enough to do peaceful, long term good in their communities but instead turn to bigotry and hatred.

 

LordChaverley - yup, we realise that we could have the PC police arresting us all for all sorts of -isms if we're not careful, assuming that the hedbangers from any side don't get at us first. What also comes out in these meals is the fact that we take our 'good vibes' away with us in to the world. One white guy is sponsoring a child through school and in to university in Africa. One of the Muslims is looking in to how he might be able to do community projects. I think that the organisations tasked with fostering good community relations could do a lot worse than shell out for people to get together round a table and indulge in that oldest of human traditions - breaking bread.

 

Greybeard - agree with the state of eceonomic affairs in other countries. I have to base my thinking on the UK - in terms of Muslim communities it's all I've had experience of.

 

Joe

[scribe]

I belong to an informal eating clup called 'The Curry Crew', of which half the members are Muslim / Pakistani, a quarter Christian / Atheist / White, a Sri Lankan and an Indian chap (Hindu) and a couple of Hong Kong Chinese.

 

This started some years ago when we all worked in the same place, and has survived the Iraq War, 7/7, etc. In our group, relationships are excellent. We call each other whitey, ****, infidel, heretic, chinky...in other words, all the names and labels that we're not supposed to use. We genuinely get on well, we exhibit a healthy interest in each others faiths and beliefs and we won't avoid discussing them when appropriate.

 

My Muslim friends all attend Friday prayers, they abstain from alcohol (though don't mind the ones of us who do drink having a beer) and also have no problems about sharing a table with people who may eat pork. (And, in my case, sharing desk space with me when I used to wander in bearing bacon sandwiches.)

 

In other words - there are significant differences, but we accept them as being what makes us individuals.

 

From my personal experience, with these friends and in the wider community, I've not experienced anything bad. Perhaps it's because I've tended to treat people with some degree of respect, and also have dealt with professional people on the whole. It would be interesting to see the socio-economic breakdown of the groups questioned. I would think that just as the poor, unskilled disaffected whites tend to be targetted by the far-right, it's quite posisble that teh similar group in Muslim communities are targetted by their head bangers.

 

Joe

Brilliant that's how it should be .How come you got uppity when i called Joe Pasquale.

[JoeP]

Brilliant that's how it should be .How come you got uppity when i called Joe Pasquale.

 

Because there are some times, with some people, when I can be as intolerant as Adolf Hitler when he realised he wasn't going to get to see in New Year 1946.

[purdyamos]

Hi meltthebell, These "educated" ones are usually misfits who would love to obtain power but do not have the ability and use other people to do their dirty work.

 

Hardly. The new leader of the Muslim Council of Britain stated explicitly in an interview a couple of weeks ago that what they were ultimately aiming for was the islamification of British society. Their previous leader, when asked what single thing he would remove/reverse in British culture replied 'women's rights'. This group is viewed as moderate and mainstream and is frequently consultated by the government.

[buck]

I notice that muslim members of this forum are very quiet about this subject. I also notice that muslims consider westerners violent. I wonder how the families of two American soldiers tortured and beheaded in Iraq might respond to that.

[JoeP]

I notice that muslim members of this forum are very quiet about this subject. I also notice that muslims consider westerners violent. I wonder how the families of two American soldiers tortured and beheaded in Iraq might respond to that.

 

Well, the Muslim members of this Forum can speak for themselves, but I have to say that I doubt it was BRITISH Muslims that killed the US Soldiers.

 

I know I shouldn't moderate a thread that I've posted on, but can I respectfully, and as a user not a Moderator, suggest that we keep this thread on topic - the attitudes of BRITISH Muslims and Non-Muslims towards each other.

[Fareast]

Looking generally at the posts on this [ and related subjects ] over the past few months , a pattern emerges where the ' Left ' seem to imagine that the ' Right ' amongst us are racially prejudiced and people who hate or dislike foreigners or people of a different faith or culture .

Actually nothing could be further from the truth ! I will stick my neck out and say that in my opinion , posters like Lord Chaverley and Timo are as broad-minded and unprejudiced as it's possible for most people to be .

In my own case , I have worked in 3 Islamic countries and have made friends there I don't think I could ever make in Britain . One man , who I regard as one of the best people I have ever met , was A Saudi schoolteacher who , apart from anything else was devoted to his family and the children he taught in his village .........and I could give countless examples .......

What Lord C. , Timo and people like us [ and I apologise for not remembering names ] have in common is something completely different . It is the fact that we are worried that over a fairly short period of time this country has had far too many people coming into it . It hardly matters if they are illegal or legal , asylum seekers or economic refugees ----------the bare fact is that the whole process has been too sudden for a lot of the indigenous population .

There was absolutely no evidence that pre-1970 , the British people were generally inhospitable ------rather the opposite , compared to other countries . However , when , in the space of a few years , whole districts or even large sections of a town become , " foreign " , the locals begin to become at least uneasy . If it seems that the government [ Tory or Labour ] is neglecting the problems of the vulnerable indigenous people , they will become annoyed , disgruntled or even violent .

That is the root cause of all the problems as regards racial prejudice and its various off-shoots . However , whenever any of us try to talk sensibly about the effects of mass immigration , we are usually accused of being B.N.P. sympathiseres ......etc.......

That is why so many people in Britain ARE turning to the extreme Right ; it's only the extreme Right that seems to listen to them . It's significant that even some of the older immigrants are getting worried about recent mass immigration !

I'll stick my neck out again and say that if you are confident about your lack of prejudice , you then feel confident enough to speak about the current problems . Sometimes with the Left , I get a feeling that , " I think that thou protesteth too much..... " i.e a bit of a guilt complex kicking in , perhaps ?