Clapped Out: Is The Nhs Broken?

[top4718]

33 minutes ago, Kidorry said:

Don`t you think it is about time people started talking about the positive things that are done in hospitals instead of slagging them off all the time. Like saving lives. All my trips to the hospitals have been very professional and with no complaints. People just love to critisise today. If you are not satisfied try paying for your treatment privately.

Discussions about changes to the NHS seem to fall into two camps:

 

1. We keep the  creaking, wasteful and failing service we have now (our record on Covid has been very poor)

 

Or

 

2. We adopt the US system which is prohibitively expensive for the majority

 

It doesn’t have to be this way, the US spends more on medical research and development than any other country in the world hence the high costs, there are far, far better systems than the NHS in European countries (Germany, Italy for example), Germany has a semi private health service that’s streets ahead of the NHS.

[Anna B]

1 hour ago, Kidorry said:

Don`t you think it is about time people started talking about the positive things that are done in hospitals instead of slagging them off all the time. Like saving lives. All my trips to the hospitals have been very professional and with no complaints. People just love to critisise today. If you are not satisfied try paying for your treatment privately.

I don't think anyone is denying the NHS does some excellent work, but the 'our NHS is wonderful' mantra stops legitimate criticism in its tracks and isn't always true. There is plenty of room for improvement. This thread is about that aspect. Comparisons with other EU countries show there are better ways of doing things and still have it 'free at the point of use.' When almost half the money in the NHS goes towards compensating and correcting some fairly outrageous, life altering mistakes something needs to be done. 

1 hour ago, top4718 said:

Discussions about changes to the NHS seem to fall into two camps:

 

1. We keep the  creaking, wasteful and failing service we have now (our record on Covid has been very poor)

 

Or

 

2. We adopt the US system which is prohibitively expensive for the majority

 

It doesn’t have to be this way, the US spends more on medical research and development than any other country in the world hence the high costs, there are far, far better systems than the NHS in European countries (Germany, Italy for example), Germany has a semi private health service that’s streets ahead of the NHS.

The US system is awful. Why do we always have to follow their lead? There are much better systems closer to home.

[Guest sibon]

2 hours ago, top4718 said:

"No ill informed criticism" then you follow it with that last line 🤣.

 

 

It’s the truth.

 

Like it or not.

Edited October 20, 2021 by sibon

[the_bloke]

1 hour ago, Anna B said:

I don't think anyone is denying the NHS does some excellent work, but the 'our NHS is wonderful' mantra stops legitimate criticism in its tracks and isn't always true. There is plenty of room for improvement. This thread is about that aspect. Comparisons with other EU countries show there are better ways of doing things and still have it 'free at the point of use.' When almost half the money in the NHS goes towards compensating and correcting some fairly outrageous, life altering mistakes something needs to be done. 

This. Absolutely this.

 

The NHS should be run like a not for profit organisation; efficiency and money saving without loss of service should always be a focus; cost and performance savings can be redirected internally. However, the NHS, like other public services, seems to be unable to grasp the concept of continuous improvement because there isn't a reason to do so. If a business got an ever increasing amount of money to operate each year without actually doing anything different to justify the increase - it hasn't operated any differently to the year before, no increase in performance, productivity, the processes are the same, the mistakes are the same - then why is it ever going to change? Fax machines are a prime example of the NHS doing things because 'it has always been this way'.

 

Add the fact that anyone trying to push changes to the NHS is responded to with strike action and being accused of privatisation doesn't help.

[top4718]

1 hour ago, sibon said:

It’s the truth.

 

Like it or not.

You have no idea who we work for or who pays the bill, we're doing very well though.

 

Bitter old man.

50 minutes ago, the_bloke said:

This. Absolutely this.

 

The NHS should be run like a not for profit organisation; efficiency and money saving without loss of service should always be a focus; cost and performance savings can be redirected internally. However, the NHS, like other public services, seems to be unable to grasp the concept of continuous improvement because there isn't a reason to do so. If a business got an ever increasing amount of money to operate each year without actually doing anything different to justify the increase - it hasn't operated any differently to the year before, no increase in performance, productivity, the processes are the same, the mistakes are the same - then why is it ever going to change? Fax machines are a prime example of the NHS doing things because 'it has always been this way'.

 

Add the fact that anyone trying to push changes to the NHS is responded to with strike action and being accused of privatisation doesn't help.

Excellent post and sums it up well.

[melthebell]

Or....have the Tories deliberately broken it so they can sell bits off?

[Guest sibon]

15 minutes ago, top4718 said:

You have no idea who we work for or who pays the bill, 

You told us all a few weeks ago.

 

Did you forget? 
 

Anyway. Back on topic. Tell us your recipe  for improving the NHS. 

Edited October 20, 2021 by sibon

[top4718]

6 minutes ago, melthebell said:

Or....have the Tories deliberately broken it so they can sell bits off?

This rumour has been doing the rounds for 30 years it still hasn't happened, I think Labours PFI contracts privatised more than the Tories have.

3 minutes ago, sibon said:

You told us all a few weeks ago.

 

Did you forget? 
 

Anyway. Back on topic. Tell us your recipe  for improving the NHS. 

I've already mentioned the German system as being an example of what we should be aiming for.

[alchresearch]

I'm still paying between £100-£200 for ex-NHS computers and printers, sometimes these machines still have the original manufacturers warranty on them.  They then go on for another 3-5 years fault free in my care.

 

The NHS buys IT equipment then scraps it after a couple of years.  Third party companies then "kindly" take these computers off their hands for pennies, test them, stick in a new blank hard disk drive then sell them for the above prices.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 20, 2021 by alchresearch

[top4718]

2 minutes ago, alchresearch said:

I'm still paying between £100-£200 for ex-NHS computers and printers, sometimes these machines still have the original manufacturers warranty on them.  They then go on for another 3-5 years fault free in my care.

 

The NHS buys IT equipment then scraps it after a couple of years.  Third party companies then "kindly" take these computers off their hands for pennies, test them, stick in a new blank hard disk drive then sell them for the above prices.

 

 

 

 

 

 

If ever a full independent audit was done on the NHS and made public there'd be no more clapping.