Charging By Miles Travelled-How Long Before That Happens?

[Annie Bynnol]

19 minutes ago, Janus said:

"Transfering £ billions of operating and infrastructure debt to the national taxpayer".

 

 

Marvellous. I wonder how the Southerners would feel if it was South Yorkshire benefitting .

One aspect of levelling up?

[Dromedary]

55 minutes ago, Annie Bynnol said:

How TfL controls Public Transport in London enjoys a whole different set of laws and regulations and exemptions to Laws applicable to the rest of England.

Here are a few:

Legally required de-regulation did not apply to London.

Imposition of competition regulation.

Imposition of threats of huge financial penalties on Councils if they interfeared.

Cross subsidy is illegal.

Integration of trams, bus, rail and underground  is much easier.

Control of route and frequency is not dictated by operator.

Transfering £ billions of operating and infrastructure debt to the national taxpayer.

Transfer of £ billions in pension liability 

Unsustainable debts which would bankrupt English Councils.

Free travel at the whim of politicians.

 

Do those 3 in bold still stand? IIRC most of it was due I believe to us being in the EU where competition and subsidy rules applied.

 

Mmmm... Having said that it looks as though we are still being controlled by the EU even though we have left!

 

https://www.traverssmith.com/knowledge/knowledge-container/the-uk-subsidy-control-bill-what-you-need-to-know/

[Annie Bynnol]

I did not bring politics into this-but you have shot yourself in the foot with this one.

Transport policies were a matter for individual states. EU had no involvement except to maintain competition and tendering rules.

Regions within states could qualify and/or apply for EU funding in a variety of ways. 

Many English schemes in the Midlands and the North were funded by the EU but blocked by the UK Government. 

This is patently obvious by the lack of transport infrastructure in the Midlands and North. 

An odd exception is the A555 because it linked to Manchester Airport and therefore attracted different funding.

 

The regions, including us have lost out on hundreds of millions of EU funding because of Brexit.

Boris promised that no region would lose out on EU funding and repeatedly promised money.

This 'fund' which included the Electric Spine, HS2 extensions, Trans Pennine between Liverpool and Hull, MML electrification to Leeds and York via Sheffield,  Northern Hub, ECML upgrade,etc. have been repeatedly cancelled/announced/cancelled...

Control of transport infrastructure that affects the Midlands and the North by Tory Governments is a disaster. 

 

You can't blame EU for this one-this is down to the Government in London.

[Dromedary]

1 hour ago, Annie Bynnol said:

I did not bring politics into this-but you have shot yourself in the foot with this one.

Why, I was asking a question about 3 aspects of what you wrote and included a link on the new "UK Subsidy Control Bill" which makes good reading when it comes to subsidies and the like.

 

Edited February 4, 2022 by Dromedary

[Dardandec]

10 hours ago, Janus said:

If no action is taken this year, the UK faces a £35bn "black hole" in its finances, they said.

 

Motorists should pay "the same or less" than they do currently, the MPs said.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60251046
 

If motorists are paying the same or less than they already do, wont there still be a £35bn black hole still? The gullible and brain washable on here will love this latest scam, I love it.

[Anna B]

The ability to travel from A to B is an essential part of modern life. Work is not local these days, neither are families. Public transport, be it buses or trains need to be efficient, available, and heavily subsidised to make it an attractive alternative to cars, otherwise there will be swathes of people who simply cannot afford to work.   

[fools]

15 hours ago, Janus said:

The MPs said charging people based on how much they drive, using technology to track cars' movements, should be considered.
 

Let's hope they get voted out, before we end up in a surveillance state like China. Freedom has a value.

 

You don't have to track a cars movements to charge based on distance traveled or electricity consumed.

 

Everyone needs roads to exist, that's how you get to work/get your food and amazon deliveries. So everyone should pay towards the upkeep of the infrastructure.

 

Scrap all road taxes, put it on vat or income tax. We don't need to tax (and be controlled in) every aspect of our lives, it's a ridiculous way to run a country.

 

Edited February 5, 2022 by fools

[geared]

Pay per mile has never been a workable solution, there's always been some enormous hole in proposal that will cause far more harm than good.

 

Usually it's something like charging more for certain roads than others, which seems like a good idea, but in reality it'll mean lots more people charging around on the 'cheaper' roads, many of which aren't really suitable for large amounts of traffic.

 

There's also the very obvious question of how much this scheme will cost to implement and run, will it actually ever make money or just continually waste what it earns?

The obvious and easy solution is to tax EV's on things like their initial cost or their weight, neither of which will really cost anything to implement.

[Annie Bynnol]

 

 

People have been paying for the use of transport infrastructure for centuries, either directly or indirectly.

Everybody already pays for our roads through VAT.

Most also pay through Income Tax, Council Tax and National Insurance.

Big transport infrastructure can only be built by central Government.

Local councils pay for local roads along which people walk, cycle, drive, deliver, use the tram, bus etc.

 

Maintenance and repair is a huge cost should be paid by the users reflecting damage(weight), pollution(engine type fuel size), need(location), usage(alternatives)etc.

 

As usual the argument boils down to 'me, me, me'.

I need lorries and vans to deliver, I need proper footways and cycle routes, I need bus route. I need taxis, I need bus and taxi lanes, I need the car for the big shop, I need the car to visit, I need the trains, I need airports etc.

Apart from my shoes, everything is taxed. I even pay 'tolls' and VAT on my taxi fare.

 

I cannot agree that one section should be exempt and they(in this argument cars) should either pay there way or reduce their impact.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[geared]

1 hour ago, Annie Bynnol said:

Apart from my shoes, everything is taxed.

 

You paid VAT on them right?  So even your shoes are taxed.

1 hour ago, Annie Bynnol said:

Maintenance and repair is a huge cost should be paid by the users reflecting damage(weight),

 

I cannot agree that one section should be exempt and they(in this argument cars) should either pay there way or reduce their impact.

 

Points worth pointing out as there's been an increasing trend towards larger and heavier cars, which is more wear and tear on the roads.

 

EV's are no better, if not worse.  Common now for them to tip the scales at 2 tonne or more.