Ukraine: Invasion Imminent?

[L00b]

37 minutes ago, Dromedary said:

I do and that's why I asked.... especially as it is yet just another Twitter rant......

Your bias is showing just a little, there.
 

Might want to re-apply some of that whattaboutery filter quick-sharp.

[Dromedary]

19 minutes ago, altus said:

We covered the Wagner Group earlier in this thread - complete with pictures of Utkin and his SS insignia tattoos. There's even lots of articles about them in the mainstream media.

Yes and when AZOZ in Ukraine was mentioned it was immediately shot down as being just a few Nazi nutters operating in Ukraine despite the contrary details. What was said on here, something about all countries have their Nazi factions including the UK.

 

 Now that the Wagner group has been highlighted because its Russian and mentioned on twitter it seems to follow that what is alleged simply must be true.

 

Me bold: They may be mentioned on mainstream media but that does not mean I will go trawling through articles just to read about them and as I don't buy into social media I really like to know about the person who posts the tweet. *** For L00b*** was that quick enough for you.... 

 

Propaganda works both ways.

 

 

Edited March 21, 2022 by Dromedary

[L00b]

54 minutes ago, Dromedary said:

Yes and when AZOZ in Ukraine was mentioned it was immediately shot down as being just a few Nazi nutters operating in Ukraine despite the contrary details. What was said on here, something about all countries have their Nazi factions including the UK.

 

 Now that the Wagner group has been highlighted because its Russian and mentioned on twitter it seems to follow that what is alleged simply must be true.

 

Me bold: They may be mentioned on mainstream media but that does not mean I will go trawling through articles just to read about them and as I don't buy into social media I really like to know about the person who posts the tweet. *** For L00b*** was that quick enough for you.... 

 

Propaganda works both ways.

Plenty quick but rather slap-dashed.

 

AZOV and Wagner have been mentioned in debate in balance to each other, since most if not all posts in this thread about the Azov group have been about “oooh aaah those bad Ukrainian Nazis”, in gossamer-thin -ly veiled attempts at justifying Putin’s self-serving de-nazification rethoric.

 

I think every reader should see who you are defending in debate, Dromedary:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wagner_Group

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dmitry_Utkin

[Dromedary]

1 hour ago, L00b said:

I think every reader should see who you are defending in debate, Dromedary:

Maybe point out where I have defended them in any debate first then every reader can then judge if you are correct in your assumptions. 

 

[harvey19]

I find GB News at 6pm with Michelle Dewbury  gives a balanced view of things by having 3 guests discussing selected subjects.

[harvey19]

What is the size of the Ukrainian armed forces ?

[butlers]

Bout 140,000 I think.

Over 300,000 Ukrainians have returned to the country since the Russian build up too and I doubt it's all Quakers

[Kidorry]

I think Pootin is trying to turn Mariupol into the 21st century Guernica.

[Findlay]

pootin is making sure no russian  dare leave the country because of the exponential number of attacks on its people including school kids scrapping. I hope russia is made to pay for the rebuilding of the whole of Ukraine, compensate all those displaced and those that have lost loved ones.

[Jim117]

6 hours ago, trastrick said:

That's the Western MSM narrative anyway.

 

A simple binary equation.

 

Democratic State Ukraine seeking freedom to "protect itself by aligning itself with a non-Soviet bloc".

 

And a mad tyrant engaging in a "vanity project to divert the attention from the economic chaos that Russia was heading for before the war, and that he has now accelerated, to ensure his re-election".

-

The reality, of course, and as usual, is far more complicated and nuanced.

 

We live in a politically and idealogically divided world.

 

Socialist Western Europe. Capitalist U.S., Communist Far East, Militant Islamist Middle East, and Oligarchy Russia. Wherever these different ideologies rub shoulders, there is Cold War friction that can easily ignitite into Hot War.

 

Countries that, by virtue of their geographic location, are adjacent to these power blocks have no choice but to align themselves with their giant neighbor.

 

Neither the Ukraine, Canada, Mexico, are really free to join any military alliance they wish, if it does not co-incide with the national security concerns of the their immediate neighbor.

 

Right now there's a lack of strong leadership in the West, and the NATO countries are addicted to Russian Oil and Gas, which they will not give up.

 

In an age where air brained celeb icons like Greta, AOC, Al Gore and their fellow travelling politicians, can have so much emotional power over the average voter, the world is a dangerous place.

 

Right now the danger is from a minor actor on the World's stage who is making fans, by tweaking the nose of a Nuclear Power, controlled by a Tyrant, to the delight of armchair freedom fighters in the West. His name is Zelensky.

 

He's the new "leader of the world", by default. Unelected everywhere but his home country, he is apparently willing to sacrifice his entire population, to the cause of his personal martyrdom.

 

He's more than willing for NATO to commence WW3, on his behalf.

 

He could stop the slaughter tomorrow! And he should! And saner heads in the West are needed, before it's too late.  Forget about climate change, fer chrissakes! This is real!

 

See

CNN

"Zelensky the One Leader Who Can Bring Americans Together"

https://www.cnn.com/2022/03/16/opinions/president-zelensky-stirring-ukraine-speech-ghitis/index.html

 

So where's joe?

 

Re your "He launched this illegal war purely as a vanity project to divert the attention from the economic chaos that Russia was heading for before the war, and that he has now accelerated, to ensure his re-election"

 

Just replace "Russia" in that paragraph, with "U.S.", and you capture Biden's involvement perfectly!

 

Why should Zelensky surrender in a war his country did not ask for and is currently winning? While Russia is using its usual tactic of shelling civilians his army is constantly mobile and hurting the Russians badly. What other leader would turn down a free ride out to stay with his people? Not Putin that’s for sure. Also on the shelling of civilians let’s all be clear. Artillery is an old, well established science which the Russians are very familiar with. Spotters correct artillery fire and guide it on to target. A job made even easier in an age of radio, GPS and drone surveillance. The lads loading and firing the guns probably don’t know what the coordinates they have been given represent but their masters will be well aware that they are shooting at residential areas, schools and hospitals.