RJRB Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 5 hours ago, trastrick said: I'm happy to wait, for what in my opinion, will an inevitable Cease Fire and diplomatic negotiations to arrive a settlement that takes ALL the directly involved parties interests into account. All the parties, would include the World at Large, Europe, Russia, Kiev, Crimea and the Donbas territories, rather than just Mr Zelenski's. (and his fans). Not everybody will be happy, they never are. Like the Afghanistanis, Iraqians, Libyans, Syrians any may others, when the West abandoned them to the Totalitarians. But better a little unhappy, and rebuilding their homes and lives, than dead! Which is what is happening now, while the West has all it's money riding on a Zelensky victory over Russia! But some naysayers here will try to find a way to say they were in favor of a compromise with Russia, all along! That will be the fun part for me, if they are still around! My only beef is how long it will take for the politicians to catch up with the grim reality. It was already too long a year ago, and the death toll is still rising! Call me weird! You are weird. At the outset there seemed to be 2 possible outcomes. That Russian forces would have far too much power and Ukraine resistance would crumble. That Ukraine might resist for a very limited period. I don’t think anyone would have forecast a Ukraine victory in the sense that Russian forces could be forced back over the border,and I doubt that anyone would think this to be a possibility in the future. What makes the view expressed in your first paragraph to be so prescient and insightful? The only clever bit would be if you were able to forecast a timescale for the inevitable to happen . At the moment I doubt that Henry Kissinger and U Thant combined could achieve a negotiated deal,but no doubt things look different from a bar stool in the DR. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trastrick Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 (edited) 15 hours ago, RJRB said: I don’t think anyone would have forecast a Ukraine victory in the sense that Russian forces could be forced back over the border,and I doubt that anyone would think this to be a possibility in the future. Why how quick the revisionism starts. Have a chat with Zelensky, and the West who are depleting their treasure chest to support him trying to fo just that! They still say he is winning. Incredible post@! But as long as we all finish agreeing there should be diplomatic compromise, I won't complain. I'll just say, welcome aboard. (Does this remind anybody of the Coronavirus Part 4 thread?) Now since we know how it will end up, in a failed effort to eject Russia from all of the Ukraine, will anybody join me in the next logical step, by calling for an immediate Cease Fire? I mean, why waste more precious Ukrainian lives on the fiasco! Edited July 19, 2023 by trastrick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 (edited) 25 minutes ago, trastrick said: (Does this remind anybody of the Coronavirus Part 4 thread?) Now since we know how it will end up, in a failed effort to eject Russia from all of the Ukraine, anybody join me in the next logical step, by calling for an immediate Cease Fire, and a holt to the weapons exports.? I mean, why waste more precious Ukrainian lives on the fiasco! It does. It reminds us that there are always 3 or 4 who think opposite to everybody else and, funnily enough, they are always the same people. No No ceasefire and welcome to the minority club again. Edited July 19, 2023 by Organgrinder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magilla Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 22 minutes ago, trastrick said: Why how quick the revisionism starts. Given your many claims in this thread over the past few days... revisionism doesn't quite cover it... outright garbage though... 🤣 22 minutes ago, trastrick said: But as long as we all finish agreeing there should be diplomatic compromise, I won't complain. I'll just say, welcome aboard. A diplomatic compromise under terms that bear no relation to the ones you propose... ...as before, more akin to the claims of many people, none of which are you! Talk about revisionism! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJRB Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 3 hours ago, trastrick said: Why how quick the revisionism starts. Have a chat with Zelensky, and the West who are depleting their treasure chest to support him trying to fo just that! They still say he is winning. Incredible post@! But as long as we all finish agreeing there should be diplomatic compromise, I won't complain. I'll just say, welcome aboard. (Does this remind anybody of the Coronavirus Part 4 thread?) Now since we know how it will end up, in a failed effort to eject Russia from all of the Ukraine, will anybody join me in the next logical step, by calling for an immediate Cease Fire? I mean, why waste more precious Ukrainian lives on the fiasco! Your posts are remarkably similar to your other contributions in that you claim some inspirational insight whilst stating the bleeding obvious. Will Russia give up any of the territories that it has taken. Extremely doubtful. Will Ukraine stop fighting to prevent further Russian control. Not any time soon. Should there be a diplomatic compromise. The sooner the better but there again a diplomatic solution in 1914,1939, in Korea or Vietnam,Yugoslavia etc,etc. would have been preferable to the ensuing chaos of war. Revisionism Lol. The passage of time does alter situations whether it be a pandemic or wars. I hope that your career as a consultant (in what discipline?) contributed some more meaningful gems than you bring to this table. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geared Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 Richard Moore was rather scathing in his assessment of recent events in Russia recently. Describing the deal to end Wagners rebellion as being forced upon Putin and a humiliation. Putin was unable to fight back against Prigozhin when it mattered and cut the deal to save his own skin. This describes a much weaker head of state than we've previously imagined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harvey19 Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 If what Russia has done is seen as wrong by world why do the Russian people still support their leaders ? Do the Russian people have reason to believe what has been done is right and in their interests ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Bundy Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 56 minutes ago, harvey19 said: If what Russia has done is seen as wrong by world why do the Russian people still support their leaders ? Do the Russian people have reason to believe what has been done is right and in their interests ? The ones I know just blame America and NATO, as so do most Eastern European folk I know. To be fair they blame everything on everyone else but their own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melthebell Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 1 hour ago, harvey19 said: If what Russia has done is seen as wrong by world why do the Russian people still support their leaders ? Do the Russian people have reason to believe what has been done is right and in their interests ? censorship and propaganda on an industrial scale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidley Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 5 minutes ago, Al Bundy said: The ones I know just blame America and NATO, as so do most Eastern European folk I know. To be fair they blame everything on everyone else but their own. My Bold. WHY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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