Midland Mainline Electrification Planning Started Again.

[RollingJ]

1 minute ago, LovePotion said:

Building work is rarely a short period. Delays often happen and there would also be drilling etc which would be unbearable to put up with all day long.

Sorry, my 'short periods' comment was about possible road closures. Don't know if you've heard, but there is going to be a lot of work going on in the Dore Station and other areas (already started) for major improvements to the Hope Valley Line.

2 minutes ago, Annie Bynnol said:

 

A basic understanding of timetabling would tell you that you cannot match the number of seats with demand when you have a varied number of coaches and which cannot be doubled up in most cases.

There will 33 new electric sets each with five coaches and they can be doubled up when required to meet demand.

 

 

I don't know about that - I use the Sheffield-London route fairly regularly, and quite often find 'doubles'.

[RollingJ]

2 minutes ago, LovePotion said:

I have heard they are installing an island platform but I am not sure how it will improve the service unless they put another track there so trains don't have to wait for the other to pass in the opposite direction.

That is one of the reasons they are re-instating the centre platform - to allow an extra track. It would be pointless otherwise.

Edited May 31, 2022 by RollingJ

[Annie Bynnol]

7 minutes ago, LovePotion said:

Building work is rarely a short period. Delays often happen and there would also be drilling etc which would be unbearable to put up with all day long.

No need to worry as the "drilling" takes place at night when you are not visiting and you will still be able to enjoy the noise, vibration and smell from the similar lovely diesels on the CrossCountry route.

[RollingJ]

Just now, LovePotion said:

That would really help with preventing  delays. The trains often get stuck at the signal box. Something useful.

Probably not, as the doubling of track is not on the full length into Sheffield.

[AndrewC]

Just now, LovePotion said:

I have heard they are installing an island platform but I am not sure how it will improve the service unless they put another track there so trains don't have to wait for the other to pass in the opposite direction.

Funny you should say that, since that is exactly what they are doing.

 

 

With regards to electrification of the mainline - most of your arguments don't really hold much water.

 

First of all, disruption to the local area is temporary (yes, even in the context of 2-3 years that can be described as 'temporary'. These things take time but the work will be finished eventually), and the idea that the wonderful views from Millhouses etc are going to ruined by the new infrastructure, I'm not sure you'll really see all that much. Most of the railway from the park is already screened by existing trees that won't be removed as far as I'm aware?  As for saying, 'there's no bad smells - just a bit of diesel'...erm..?! 

 

The current services can be unreliable and some improvements to services and times can be made with electric trains. You say fares won't drop, obviously that's a contentious issue since we all know fares are a bit of a sham in this country! I'd perhaps say ask yourself how much they would continue to carry on increasing by, if they continue to rely on ageing, diesel-powered locomotives which use an outdated and ever more expenses fuel. Which brings me to the last point:

 

Electrification of our railways is as important in tackling both local pollution and global climate change as changing buses, lorries, private motor vehicles from petrol/diesel to electric is. There's no plausible argument for allowing trains to continue to use fossil fuels if electrification is deliverable - it's unsustainable in both environmental and economic terms.

[RollingJ]

13 minutes ago, LovePotion said:

The track multiplies as you get closer to Sheffield, I'd have thought it would allow a late running train to be over taken there also. If I am waiting for a train to Sheffield (the local Northern one), it often gets held up for a late running TransPennine or EMR train to enter Totley tunnel. The Northern train and the TransPennine trains usually depart Sheffield for Manchester within three minutes of each other, so it does get rather sticky.

The hold-ups are not usually for long though 2-3 minutes? and they usually catch  up - until they get to the Manchester area where they hit the congestion problems there.

[Annie Bynnol]

2 hours ago, RollingJ said:

 

I don't know about that - I use the Sheffield-London route fairly regularly, and quite often find 'doubles'.

They can stick two short formed class 222's together but the MML platforms at St Pancras are too short to hold anything longer. Since the HST's have gone there was going to be a shortage but the covid timetable and four180's have plugged the gap until the new trains are delivered next year. 

 

As all the 222's are based in Derby bringing them out/back in the early morning/evening sometimes involves double sets- also reduces the number of drivers needed (and gives the impression of being empty). 

The new trains are all 5 coaches especially made when doubled to fit into St Pancras- each coach is shorter but sits more passengers (also less first class).

[RollingJ]

Fair enough. I know the MML platforms are short at STP , but the train I catch is usually the one arond 11.00 AM, and post-covid the train is usually 'empty' compared to before, whichever sets they use.

[Annie Bynnol]

2 hours ago, LovePotion said:

Having lived next to selfish neighbours who have spent two years doing construction work on their house, 2-3 years is a long time.

 

A 2-3 year timescale is way out, as is the idea that it is equivalent to a fixed building site. The noisy piling bit passes at the rate of about 400m a night.

Trackwork has been ongoing on for several months between Sheffield station and Millhouses mostly at night.

Has this been noticed by the railways neighbours? B&Q car park is being used at the moment.

 

 

This Network Rail video is informative.

 

 

 

 

[DavidFrance]

On 30/05/2022 at 16:48, Annie Bynnol said:

Electrification planning to Sheffield is back on.

Inline with the current(!) way that the MML is being electrified in stages, which has crept up to Wigston(south of Leicester).

What is new is that the next stages have been announced by Network Rail who are inviting contractors to Derby in June to look at the plans for electrification from Wigston to Nottingham and Sheffield(130km).

 

The stages will be:

Wigston South to Syston(through Leicester)

Syston to the Trent 

Trent to Derby and Trent to Nottingham

Derby to Ambergate

Ambergate to London Road 

Sheffield station

 

The new 33 five-car Class 810 on order for the MML to be delivered from 2023, are able to run on or off electrified lines so that they do not have wait for electrification to be completed all the way between Sheffield and London.

Also being completed is the upgrade of the electrification between Bedford and London which allows more and faster electrics.

 

No dates for completion are being set.

The Government no longer wants to see big deadlines being missed and the associated cost overruns so this staged approach is to their liking.

This staged method has apparently enabled Network Rail and it contractors to work more efficiently and closer to estimated costs.

Is Central Office aware of this party political broadcast on behalf of the Conservative Party? It seems to be making promises that have been made before....time and time again. Start electrification from Sheffield southwards and I might....just might...believe it.