Shipping Containers Coming To Fargate

[Planner1]

1 minute ago, harvey19 said:

Who holds those records ?

 

The people who own the plant hold and upkeep their records, like I said before.

[Meltman]

10 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

You’ve basically got an unreasonable expectation.

 

How many years ago was that sewer put in? 20 or more?

 

Some people working for the council weren’t even born then. Employees and managers  come and go. It isn’t reasonable to expect there to be someone on a project team that knows and remembers everything that may have gone into the ground at some point or other.

 

Designers follow a process, there will be a checklist. If it’s a temporary structure, they don’t need to make enquiries about buried utilities. That’s the standard process which is clearly fine for the vast majority of cases. Sadly this was an exception. 
 

It isn’t a case of making a call or sending an email. There’s a formal process to making enquiries with utilities about where their plant is located. It takes time, there is a cost.

 

 

 

 

I understand everything you have said but find it poor that professionals  don't have to ask/can't ask/can't be bothered to ask about things which are likely to affect a project. 

For example.

.how did they expect to get power (electricity /gas) and waste disposal (sewage) to and from the containers without asking? Or did they assume they would be there..

Or.

Assume someone else would ask...

Or look at a plan (which they don't have .

Or some other means. 

Excuse like they don't have to, procedures don't require,  the staff are young/ dont remember etc are annoying,  but what do I know  I'm an ordinary bloke  not a professional. 

[harvey19]

18 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

 

The people who own the plant hold and upkeep their records, like I said before.

Who would hold plans detailing where the sewers are in town ?

[Planner1]

8 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

Who would hold plans detailing where the sewers are in town ?

Yorkshire Water as far as I’m aware.

[Planner1]

14 minutes ago, Meltman said:

I understand everything you have said but find it poor that professionals  don't have to ask/can't ask/can't be bothered to ask about things which are likely to affect a project. 

For example.

.how did they expect to get power (electricity /gas) and waste disposal (sewage) to and from the containers without asking? Or did they assume they would be there..

Or.

Assume someone else would ask...

Or look at a plan (which they don't have .

Or some other means. 

Excuse like they don't have to, procedures don't require,  the staff are young/ dont remember etc are annoying,  but what do I know  I'm an ordinary bloke  not a professional. 

Asking a utility for a power, water, phone or sewage connection is different to asking where their plant is located.

 

The fact that no one person or group of people out of thousands of employees can be expected to have an encyclopaedic knowledge of buried services isn’t an excuse, it’s a fact.

 

Processes have to be suitable to be used by anyone, not just those who have an intimate knowledge of an area.

 

Utility records are vast. They cover a massive area and are constantly being changed and updated. 

 

 

[Meltman]

7 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

Yorkshire Water as far as I’m aware.

So,  did anyone contact Yorkshire Water to ask about waste disposal from the temporary containers? If not...what was the plan to dispose of waste water from the food outlets...and if they did...why wasn't the sewer brought up?

[ads36]

4 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

constantly being changed and updated. 

...and lost!

 

we recently had a water leak at work - it took specialists a week to find the pipe, the building's only 15 years old!

 

Edited February 21, 2023 by ads36

[Meltman]

I guess it's unreasonable to expect a person who looks after car parks to know about a sewer....even though it's a  massive sewer!

 

Processes have to be suitable for anyone and not just those who have an intimate knowledge of an area...your words...and so they should. and stop problems arising such as this. If the process was suitable (and adhered to,) it would negate the lack of knowledge/ age/ memory of the staff 

[Planner1]

5 minutes ago, Meltman said:

So,  did anyone contact Yorkshire Water to ask about waste disposal from the temporary containers? If not...what was the plan to dispose of waste water from the food outlets...and if they did...why wasn't the sewer brought up?

 

As I’ve already said, there are processes for requesting connections to gas, electric, water, sewers, telecoms. Those are different to processes for getting access to records of buried plant.

 

The containers were occupied and functioned so they clearly got access to the necessary services ( or put temporary arrangements in place like the generator).  I don’t know who did what, how or why.

Just now, Meltman said:

I guess it's unreasonable to expect a person who looks after car parks to know about a sewer....even though it's a  massive sewer!

 

Processes have to be suitable for anyone and not just those who have an intimate knowledge of an area...your words...and so they should. and stop problems arising such as this. If the process was suitable (and adhered to,) it would negate the lack of knowledge/ age/ memory of the staff 

The process apparently is that for a temporary structures, it is not necessary to make enquiries about buried plant.

[Planner1]

11 minutes ago, ads36 said:

...and lost!

 

we recently had a water leak at work - it took specialists a week to find the pipe, the building's only 15 years old!

 

It isn’t uncommon for utilities records to be inaccurate.

 

On big schemes they tend to do their own investigations ( like ground penetrating radar and excavations) as well as making the normal enquiries. Even then problems are sometimes encountered.