Nowt Left In The Coffers Say Scc

[Planner1]

21 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

Just noticed the London scheme is called the Holland scheme.  Isn't Holland a very flat country where cycle use has always been popular for this reason

They are called Little Holland schemes, like I said earlier.

 

Cycling in Holland declined just like it did here. It’s only reached current levels because the government decided to put in place the infrastructure to support it.

16 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

What percentage of people are expected to walk or cycle instead of using their cars in Sheffield.

It must have been calculated at the many planning meetings.

Will the scheme be scrapped if there are not enough people converting ?

Why are you asking me? Do your own research.

[harvey19]

1 minute ago, Planner1 said:

They are called Little Holland schemes, like I said earlier.

 

Cycling in Holland declined just like it did here. It’s only reached current levels because the government decided to put in place the infrastructure to support it.

And people took it up because of the flat nature of the land.

I used Holland instead of Little Holland to emphasise my point .

You are neglecting a lot of points raised.

I am sure you believe in the scheme but maybe after reading the points raised criticising it's implementation in Sheffield you will appreciate it is not viable in some people's opinion.

As I said at the start of our debate, theoretically a good idea, realistically impractical.

[Planner1]

3 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

And people took it up because of the flat nature of the land.

I used Holland instead of Little Holland to emphasise my point .

You are neglecting a lot of points raised.

I am sure you believe in the scheme but maybe after reading the points raised criticising it's implementation in Sheffield you will appreciate it is not viable in some people's opinion.

As I said at the start of our debate, theoretically a good idea, realistically impractical.

People took it up because it was safe and practical. As I’ve already said and you’ve ignored, terrain is not generally an issue, most folk can walk up hills and bikes have gears, lots of them and there are electric bikes too which can easily go up any hill.

I don’t need you to lecture me on what people think about schemes like this.

 

Having been involved in highways schemes of all sorts for decades, I’ve probably heard every opinion there is, many times over.

 

You’re entitled to your opinion, but in my view you are wrong. These schemes are not impractical at all and it appears they will deliver modal shift which increases over time. 

[harvey19]

22 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

They are called Little Holland schemes, like I said earlier.

 

Cycling in Holland declined just like it did here. It’s only reached current levels because the government decided to put in place the infrastructure to support it.

Why are you asking me? Do your own research.

I ask you because you are speaking in support of the scheme and I expected you to base your support on these facts.

[Planner1]

2 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

I ask you because you are speaking in support of the scheme and I expected you to base your support on these facts.

You’re speaking against these schemes and your opposition isn’t based on any facts.

 

I’m just explaining how things work and why things happen the way they do.

[harvey19]

2 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

People took it up because it was safe and practical. As I’ve already said and you’ve ignored, terrain is not generally an issue, most folk can walk up hills and bikes have gears, lots of them and there are electric bikes too which can easily go up any hill.

I don’t need you to lecture me on what people think about schemes like this.

 

Having been involved in highways schemes of all sorts for decades, I’ve probably heard every opinion there is, many times over.

 

You’re entitled to your opinion, but in my view you are wrong. These schemes are not impractical at all and it appears they will deliver modal shift which increases over time. 

 

The basis of your arguments seems to be bikes have gears and there are electric bikes whilst neglecting all the other points raised.

I have not intended to lecture you but put forward relevant points relevant to the public.

Whilst involved in highways schemes have you found the opinions of the general public been acted upon when they were contrary to the planners schemes ?

 

 

[Meltman]

1 minute ago, harvey19 said:

I ask you because you are speaking in support of the scheme and I expected you to base your support on these facts.

Of course #Planner1 is in support of the scheme, that's why he/she is saying it's brilliant and thinks other people's opinions are wrong. The scheme may be fine and work for some people, maybe like #Planner1, who can walk/run or jump on their electric bike to go where they want to but for many more who cant do the same it won't.

[harvey19]

4 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

You’re speaking against these schemes and your opposition isn’t based on any facts.

 

I’m just explaining how things work and why things happen the way they do.

I asked how the facts you quoted for London were gathered to gain a better understanding of their relevance to Sheffield.

[Planner1]

Just now, Meltman said:

Of course #Planner1 is in support of the scheme, that's why he/she is saying it's brilliant and thinks other people's opinions are wrong. The scheme may be fine and work for some people, maybe like #Planner1, who can walk/run or jump on their electric bike to go where they want to but for many more who cant do the same it won't.

Care to point out where I’ve said it’s “ brilliant”?

 

These schemes  don’t work for everyone and may cause some people some problems, but they work just fine for the vast majority. You are never ever going to please everyone. There’s always a trade off. You usually have to give something to get something. If you want the advantages of a better, quieter, safer and less polluted environment to live in, the trade off is that access by motor vehicle will be a bit longer.

 

It remains to be seen whether in the longer term, people think the trade off is worth it.

[Planner1]

14 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

I asked how the facts you quoted for London were gathered to gain a better understanding of their relevance to Sheffield.

Check out the research here