Sheffield Congestion Charge From Feb 27th 2023

[Meltman]

2 minutes ago, HeHasRisen said:

Probably not, the request to the DVLA will be "does this vehicle need to be charged under the terms of a category C (think thats the term?) CAZ"?

 

It wont be bothered with lack of VED, MOT and/or insurance, thats still a job for the feds.

Ok, I understand.  But is the DVLA system going to be able to cope with that question about every vehicle that enters the zone, every day and from every CAZ in the country. That must be many thousands of vehicles per hour/per day?

[soopah]

1 hour ago, mike1961 said:

Another point I feel is worth mentioning is ,if the air quality just about scrapes through as good then as people naturally replace their vehicles over time to more environmentally friendly ones then won't the air quality just naturally improve anyway without the need for this stupid Caz Zone ,which we all know is about making money and nothing to do with cleaning the air .

There was an article the other day about how the now defunct cameras in Manchester have been helping out the police as ANPR cameras, but the crux of the article was "that no public consultation was required as to the future use of the cameras once the funding to install them was aquired"
Meaning that once they are installed, whether the scheme is still active or not they've basically got free reign of what to use the cameras for.
More surveillance by stealth

[The_DADDY]

4 minutes ago, soopah said:

There was an article the other day about how the now defunct cameras in Manchester have been helping out the police as ANPR cameras, but the crux of the article was "that no public consultation was required as to the future use of the cameras once the funding to install them was aquired"
Meaning that once they are installed, whether the scheme is still active or not they've basically got free reign of what to use the cameras for.
More surveillance by stealth

Very probably. 

These cameras will also come in very 'useful' when we end up with road pricing. 

[HeHasRisen]

45 minutes ago, Meltman said:

Ok, I understand.  But is the DVLA system going to be able to cope with that question about every vehicle that enters the zone, every day and from every CAZ in the country. That must be many thousands of vehicles per hour/per day?

Must be something that is automated I would have thought.

[birobasher]

Mike, someone has to start, otherwise we're all screwed. Any reduction of CO2 will at least lessen the effects of heating above the 1.5C average. Mitigation is what it's about, because there's some seriously bad things coming our way now whatever we do. 

[Planner1]

4 hours ago, mike1961 said:

Another point I feel is worth mentioning is ,if the air quality just about scrapes through as good then as people naturally replace their vehicles over time to more environmentally friendly ones then won't the air quality just naturally improve anyway without the need for this stupid Caz Zone ,which we all know is about making money and nothing to do with cleaning the air .

It’s nothing to do with making money.

 

It’s pretty obvious that the government were minded that as you say, improvements in vehicle emissions would eventually bring air quality within legal limits. 

 

However, government were taken to court by environmental activists and the courts instructed the government to rectify the problem as quickly as possible. 
 

That’s why CAZ’s are being introduced. 
 

The charging is a way of encouraging vehicle owners to upgrade to cleaner ones, that’s all. 

[The_DADDY]

4 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

It’s nothing to do with making money.

Snipped 

Have you considered doing stand up comedy?

With jokes like that youll make a fortune. 

[mike1961]

19 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

It’s nothing to do with making money.

 

It’s pretty obvious that the government were minded that as you say, improvements in vehicle emissions would eventually bring air quality within legal limits. 

 

However, government were taken to court by environmental activists and the courts instructed the government to rectify the problem as quickly as possible. 
 

That’s why CAZ’s are being introduced. 
 

The charging is a way of encouraging vehicle owners to upgrade to cleaner ones, that’s all. 

Who runs the country then ,is it the government or is it the courts?.

What would have happened if the government said no to the court ruling?.

 

To be honest at the moment it feels very much like that the majority are having to bend over backwards for the minority in so many different situations.

 

23 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

It’s nothing to do with making money.

 

It’s pretty obvious that the government were minded that as you say, improvements in vehicle emissions would eventually bring air quality within legal limits. 

 

However, government were taken to court by environmental activists and the courts instructed the government to rectify the problem as quickly as possible. 
 

That’s why CAZ’s are being introduced. 
 

The charging is a way of encouraging vehicle owners to upgrade to cleaner ones, that’s all. 

Carrot and stick ,trouble is the stick eg the fines are too big at the moment particularly with the current cost of living crisis and the carrots are way way too small eg the grants to upgrade your vehicle.

 

This nonsense has to stop

[S35_2o21]

13 hours ago, soopah said:

There was an article the other day about how the now defunct cameras in Manchester have been helping out the police as ANPR cameras, but the crux of the article was "that no public consultation was required as to the future use of the cameras once the funding to install them was aquired"
Meaning that once they are installed, whether the scheme is still active or not they've basically got free reign of what to use the cameras for.
More surveillance by stealth

Surely this is subject to a legal challenge though, due to GDPR stipulations. I am no expert but I thought that data had to be captured for a specific purpose and only used for that purpose. The potential of 'mission creep' for this kind of technology is scary. 

 

Hopefully those pesky lawyers will challenge this. 

 

14 hours ago, HeHasRisen said:

Probably not, the request to the DVLA will be "does this vehicle need to be charged under the terms of a category C (think thats the term?) CAZ"?

 

It wont be bothered with lack of VED, MOT and/or insurance, thats still a job for the feds.

We are waiting to see if we get a PCN for crossing the Dartford bridge over the NY period. Our car was previously a motability vehicle. We bought the car in October and the forms were completed to change the use with the DVLA. We tried to pay the toll for crossing the bridge, but we couldn't as the car is still listed as exempt. So now we are waiting to see if we get a PCN. It's now nearly 3 months later and no sign of a PCN. I'm guessing that the DVLA are as snowed under with these kinds of requests.  

[Planner1]

10 hours ago, mike1961 said:

Who runs the country then ,is it the government or is it the courts?.

What would have happened if the government said no to the court ruling?.

 

To be honest at the moment it feels very much like that the majority are having to bend over backwards for the minority in so many different situations.

 

Carrot and stick ,trouble is the stick eg the fines are too big at the moment particularly with the current cost of living crisis and the carrots are way way too small eg the grants to upgrade your vehicle.

 

This nonsense has to stop

The government set the laws, but the courts enforce them.

 

It can’t be denied that the air quality is in breach of legal limits, so you can’t blame people for not being happy about it and wanting redress in court.

 

The courts can enforce the law by imposing very large fines ( many millions). The government have sidestepped this now by passing a law allowing them to passport any fines received directly to any local authority where exceedences of legal limits have brought on the fines.

 

The fines for not paying a CAZ fee aren’t that big, £60 if paid within 14 days. You can always argue for more grants for upgrades no matter how much the government gave.