Hospitals In Crisis

[Dromedary]

1 hour ago, Mister M said:

....

Perhaps there's a lot of disquiet in the country that people can't get to see GPs, and MPs are hearing this from their constituents, and MPs are wanting to change things so people can see their GPs. 

That seems to vary a lot as I have had no problem seeing mine. Make an appointment online for a call-back, wait for call, describe problems and get an appointment to see a GP if necessary. Or just make an appointment online and turn up when ready.

 

1 hour ago, Mister M said:

Nothing is set in stone yet, and Streeting is wanting feedback. But the system at the moment just isn't working at all for many people.

Agreed there are problems as it is in need of major reform. It has gone far and wide of what it was originally designed to do and needs to get back to, dare I say it... the basics, as some of the stuff that the NHS are now doing is far beyond what it was intended to do. 

 

1 hour ago, Mister M said:

Social care needs to be taken back into LAs and the NHS. It is so fragmented, and is clearly broken, at least Labour recognise that 

I disagree as that will not solve the problems. It maybe fragmented and a bit broken but even when they were run by LAs or under NHS control bad management and abuse was fairy rife, and the whole system suffered as a result. A lot of children in social care when we had LA children's homes suffered terribly from physical and sexual abuse as well.

[Mister M]

40 minutes ago, Dromedary said:

That seems to vary a lot as I have had no problem seeing mine. Make an appointment online for a call-back, wait for call, describe problems and get an appointment to see a GP if necessary. Or just make an appointment online and turn up when ready.

There does seem to be a postcode lottery. Not just in terms of seeing the GP, but what treatments patients will get too.

Quote

 

Agreed there are problems as it is in need of major reform. It has gone far and wide of what it was originally designed to do and needs to get back to, dare I say it... the basics, as some of the stuff that the NHS are now doing is far beyond what it was intended to do. 

The system as it was designed in 1948 The principles of the NHS were to provide a comprehensive service funded by taxation, available to all and free at the time of need. I think the NHS and care systems have changed in that they really promote a person's independence in the way that staff work with patients.

Those principles are good however

• People are living much longer, so care of the elderly in their own homes, or in nursing homes needs to be taken into consideration
• Similarly society has changed since 1948. Both people in households (typically husband and wives) both work because they have to. This means that caring for elderly and disabled relatives falls to the care sector much more. The needs of people who do look after adult and disabled members of society are completely neglected. It is disgraceful.
• Science and medicine have delivered treatments which prolong lives, which is a good thing. However, people need to take more responsibility for themselves more so they don't get sick in the first place. To an extent, many people are doing this with people drastically cutting down on cigarette smoking in the last 15/20 years.
• Social prescribing could be extended e.g. exercise referrals, community treatment in terms of mental ill health and stopping people getting ill in the first place.
• I think if people abuse the system, or the people who work in the system (which has always happened - and they don't have dementia, mental ill health issues, or medical problems that cause confusion or aggression), then this needs to be addressed - such as refusal of treatment.

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I disagree as that will not solve the problems. It maybe fragmented and a bit broken but even when they were run by LAs or under NHS control bad management and abuse was fairy rife, and the whole system suffered as a result. A lot of children in social care when we had LA children's homes suffered terribly from physical and sexual abuse as well.

Bad management is rife currently. One case which highlighted this was the Panorama expose of the Winterbourne View care home for adults with complex needs. There was some terrible cases of abuse in the old psychiatric hospitals too. Similarly with childrens's homes. Newsnight, in the last couple of years, have done some investigations into dreadful neglect of young adults who were orphaned, or placed into care.

Abuse is not restricted to the type of service as such (e.g. private or state); what would help, I think, is a beefed up system of the CQC (a bit like OFSTED for schools), and more robust whistle blowing procedures.

 

There are a lot of great things that happen in the NHS and Social Care system every day up and down the country, and I wouldn't want to deny that. Indeed a lot of what makes the system great is how staff in Health & Social Care, as well as informal carers in the community, give way over and above what they are expected to do. I think this is one of the reasons why so many people in the system are just ****** off, because their good will is taken for granted. Or they are told by Steven Barclay, the current H&SC Secretary, that they must "increase their productivity" if they want a pay rise.

Edited January 10, 2023 by Mister M

[El Cid]

7 hours ago, Mister M said:

It's been reported that Labour are reverting to the system of GPs as salaried NHS staff

 

I was listening to Iain Dale on LBC last week, and he had a professor of Oncology on explaining why he thinks the NHS is in crisis, where it's gone wrong, and what can be done to put it right.
While I don't agree with everything he said, some of it did make sense.
I've uploaded it here for folks on here to have a listen - definitely thought provoking.

 

lan Dale is just a paid conservative spokesperson, I wouldn't trust him or his specially chosen guests.

I don't care if doctors work privately or for the NHS. It could improve the weekend working contract with GPs, but taking them into the NHS will solve that.

[Mister M]

48 minutes ago, El Cid said:

lan Dale is just a paid conservative spokesperson, I wouldn't trust him or his specially chosen guests.

I don't care if doctors work privately or for the NHS. It could improve the weekend working contract with GPs, but taking them into the NHS will solve that.

Although he stood unsuccessfully as a prospective Conservative parliamentary candidate, I wouldn't completely dismiss everything he or his guests say about the NHS. 

I think he's a bit more independent minded than you're giving him credit for.

[El Cid]

40 minutes ago, Mister M said:

Although he stood unsuccessfully as a prospective Conservative parliamentary candidate, I wouldn't completely dismiss everything he or his guests say about the NHS. 

I think he's a bit more independent minded than you're giving him credit for.

He and his audience are on the right and prefer news that is easy to digest, they prefer opinions.

He has got rich by being intelligent and appealing to the Conservatives.

It would be interesting to count how man Conservative/Labour ex MPs or supporters are in the media. 

Edited January 10, 2023 by El Cid

[Mister M]

1 hour ago, El Cid said:

He and his audience are on the right and prefer news that is easy to digest, they prefer opinions.

He has got rich by being intelligent and appealing to the Conservatives.

It would be interesting to count how man Conservative/Labour ex MPs or supporters are in the media. 

Okay - far be it from me to stick up for Tories 

Edited January 11, 2023 by Mister M

[Anna B]

University training should be free at the point of use for doctors, nurses and other shortage areas of health professionals. On the proviso that they do at least 5 years in the NHS post training.

 

We should be investing in more medical schools (or ensuring that the ones we have give places primarily to the local population first.) Or with a rising population (particularly of the elderly,) the shortages will only get worse.

 

We've known about this for a long time.

 

[Tipstaff]

On 09/01/2023 at 10:28, S35_2o21 said:

GP's are private providers, working to an NHS contract. This is the same with the NHS Trusts (Acute hospitals, MH Trusts etc). 

Thanks for this.  But to the 'lay person' they're still part of our NHS system and as such a level of service is expected.

[harvey19]

How have we got into this state ?

No one in authority seems to want to answer this question except by saying more money is needed.

Doctors and nurses who work in the private sector will have been trained by the NHS and if anything goes wrong after private health care the NHS has to undertake remedial treatment.

Has there been any future planning which was accurate.?

 

[L00b]

1 hour ago, harvey19 said:

How have we got into this state ?

(…)

 

By failing to hold your governance to account, for years on end.

 

Sure, wasn’t it just great to give the rods to Europe, and wasn’t that man Johnson quite the amusing fellow with all the oven-ready answers, and wasn’t Patel quite the tough act on immigration out-of- control, and <…>

 

…and now you’re getting the invoice for successive Conservative governments doing little else than infighting and electioneering for years on end, instead of planning and implementing.

Edited January 12, 2023 by L00b