Save Our Streets

[The_DADDY]

7 minutes ago, Anna B said:

'If voting made a difference, they wouldn't allow it' 

I don't know who said that quote, but it's probably true.

 

Democracy is a sham to let the little people think they have any control over what happens and who spends their money. 

They don't, as this farce in Sheffield shows. The politicians get into power, ignore the voters, disavow their manifestoes, forget common sense, and do whatever they like, feathering their own nests along the way.

We have no power other than civil disobedience and withholding our taxes.

 

As Grandma used to say, 'It doesn't matter who you vote for, the Government always gets in.'

 

My bold.

And isn't that the problem. They get into 'power' they don't get into 'service'.

[Anna B]

10 hours ago, Planner1 said:

Been tried elsewhere, made no meaningful difference to traffic congestion.

Yes it has. It did in Sheffield. 

And don't quote me some survey. They are always done so as to reach the conclusion they want.

People might have said they won't use public transport (if that is correct) because they've experienced the rubbish current system and based it on that. What we need is a fully integrated, regular and reliable system like they have in other countries.

If they want cars off the road, what is the alternative? 

[E-Man Groovin]

I agree with the grinder (and Anna B). #SaveAbbeydale

[Guest]

9 hours ago, Planner1 said:

So the person who points out the flaw  in your argument is incompetent.

 

I see. 

Not the person, the whole  lot of you or the city / cities,  would not be in such a mess

 

5 hours ago, Anna B said:

Yes it has. It did in Sheffield. 

And don't quote me some survey. They are always done so as to reach the conclusion they want.

People might have said they won't use public transport (if that is correct) because they've experienced the rubbish current system and based it on that. What we need is a fully integrated, regular and reliable system like they have in other countries.

If they want cars off the road, what is the alternative? 

Exactly,  glad someone else agrees.

Unfortunately, it's trying to get through to planners and councillors who like to try and push water uphill.

 

 

[Planner1]

7 hours ago, Anna B said:

Yes it has. It did in Sheffield. 

And don't quote me some survey. They are always done so as to reach the conclusion they want.

People might have said they won't use public transport (if that is correct) because they've experienced the rubbish current system and based it on that. What we need is a fully integrated, regular and reliable system like they have in other countries.

If they want cars off the road, what is the alternative? 

Public transport in Sheffield was never free.

 

It was cheap, not free up to 1986.

 

Even then, bus  ridership was falling and car ownership and usage increasing.
 

People also forget that the money to subsidise public transport  has to come from somewhere. Back in the day there was a lot of dissatisfaction with the high level of rates here, which is where the subsidy money came from.

 

Good integrated public transport costs big money and needs the right legal framework. Governments over the last 40 years have shown no inclination to provide them. Even Transport for London are struggling to maintain their service levels due to enormous funding deficits. 
 

Do we think the public are prepared to pay for this integrated transport utopia?

 

 

[harvey19]

58 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

Public transport in Sheffield was never free.

 

It was cheap, not free up to 1986.

 

Even then, bus  ridership was falling and car ownership and usage increasing.
 

People also forget that the money to subsidise public transport  has to come from somewhere. Back in the day there was a lot of dissatisfaction with the high level of rates here, which is where the subsidy money came from.

 

Good integrated public transport costs big money and needs the right legal framework. Governments over the last 40 years have shown no inclination to provide them. Even Transport for London are struggling to maintain their service levels due to enormous funding deficits. 
 

Do we think the public are prepared to pay for this integrated transport utopia?

 

 

Rates did not come down when bus fares went up !

Will public transport availability be taken into consideration when roads are blocked off ?

[Planner1]

7 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

Will public transport availability be taken into consideration when roads are blocked off ?

What do you mean?

[harvey19]

3 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

What do you mean?

The plant pots.

[Planner1]

2 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

The plant pots.

Low traffic neighbourhoods?

 

Closures are on residential side streets and don’t affect public transport.

[harvey19]

1 minute ago, Planner1 said:

Low traffic neighbourhoods?

 

Closures are on residential side streets and don’t affect public transport.

Just as an aside I remember traffic going on the Moor and Fargate etc.

Also remember the trams clanking up and down.

We talk of clean air nowadays but I am old enough to remember the days of chimneys smoking from coal fires in every house, factories churning out smoke and going to school with a scarf wrapped around my mouth because of the smog. Often black particles from the smog would be attached to washing left out on a line.

My point is that my father lived to 89, my mother 92 and grandfathers lived well into their 80s  having lived through these times.

I appreciate the argument is that they would not have lived so long if the city had not been cleaned up ref. coal fires etc.