Sheffield Becoming A 15 Minute City

[top4718]

8 hours ago, HumbleNarrator said:

The root cause of the frustration with many people about these types of initiatives, whether it be the 15 minute city or CAZ/ULEZ etc, is that people feel as though the rug has been suddenly pulled out from under their feet.

We of this generation have all been born into a society/economy that has been orientated around motor vehicle use. These motor vehicles hitherto have combustion engines which pollute the environment. This is not our fault. 

Punishing people for simply going about their lives in this paradigm is the wrong way to go about it.

They've used the car/motorist as a cash cow for decades now want to blame us for using them, I remember the huge push to convert everyone to diesel cars in the late 80's early 90's as it was said to be more environmentally friendly, I wonder what "science" made them arrive at the conclusion,

[The_DADDY]

1 minute ago, top4718 said:

They've used the car/motorist as a cash cow for decades now want to blame us for using them, I remember the huge push to convert everyone to diesel cars in the late 80's early 90's as it was said to be more environmentally friendly, I wonder what "science" made them arrive at the conclusion,

Probably used the same scientists they used for convid.

[dave_the_m]

11 hours ago, top4718 said:

They've used the car/motorist as a cash cow for decades now want to blame us for using them, I remember the huge push to convert everyone to diesel cars in the late 80's early 90's as it was said to be more environmentally friendly, I wonder what "science" made them arrive at the conclusion,

The science was that diesel engines are more efficient and produce less CO2 per mile than petrol engines per mile. That was true, and remains true. Since then, more has been discovered by scientists about the effects of the small particulates produced by diesel engines on the lungs. So the decision making has become more of a trade off: global efficiency versus local heath effects to people living close to areas of heavy diesel traffic.

[Bargepole23]

20 hours ago, HumbleNarrator said:

The root cause of the frustration with many people about these types of initiatives, whether it be the 15 minute city or CAZ/ULEZ etc, is that people feel as though the rug has been suddenly pulled out from under their feet.

We of this generation have all been born into a society/economy that has been orientated around motor vehicle use. These motor vehicles hitherto have combustion engines which pollute the environment. This is not our fault. 

Punishing people for simply going about their lives in this paradigm is the wrong way to go about it.

Alternatively, more has been discovered about the long term effects of high levels of particulate and other pollution, and that, combined with the continued growth in commercial vehicle and car mileage, means that change is neccessary.

[ads36]

it's a position that I have some patience for - i don't disagree - we've been prioritising car use for 70 years.

 

cars are great, i love mine!

 

But when everyone has got one (or 3) - there's no room to park, and when everyone uses them for short journeys - we get terrible congestion.

 

*something* has to change, surely? unless we accept that doing nothing means congestion getting worse, every year, forever.

Edited March 28, 2023 by ads36

[Guest]

1 hour ago, ads36 said:

it's a position that I have some patience for - i don't disagree - we've been prioritising car use for 70 years.

 

cars are great, i love mine!

 

But when everyone has got one (or 3) - there's no room to park, and when everyone uses them for short journeys - we get terrible congestion.

 

*something* has to change, surely? unless we accept that doing nothing means congestion getting worse, every year, forever.

Most of it is down to the fact that most people are bone idle and won't walk anywhere even when the weather is lovely.

I used to remark, 40 years ago,  that only one other guy besides me, who lived on our street, ever walked to the local shopping centre.

Even in those days, everyone climbed into their cars to fetch a newspaper or a packet of fags.

When you look at them from behind, you can tell which were which too.

Good luck with the 15 minute neighbourhoods when they happen.

 

 

[top4718]

We have a useless and expensive public transport system, more and more women have been encouraged to work over the last few decades, people were told to travel for work if need be, freight was kept on roads rather than using alternatives like rail, as I said the car has (and still is) being used as a cash cow and now they want to penalise people who have few real alternatives.

[Guest makapaka]

One thing I would say - If the government and local authorities are gonna push this ideal then they need to put their money where their mouth is.

 

and it would cost billions to make it workable.

 

im not against it: but using crookes and Walkley as an example - we now have an “active neighbourhood” where they’ve basically shut roads to get people to not use their cars.

 

the result is loads of ugly temporary lights, concrete road blocks, planters with dead plants - strewn all over the area.

 

and every morning I join a queue of idling cars that wasn’t there before it started.

 

sh or get off the pot comes to mind.

Edited March 28, 2023 by makapaka

[The_DADDY]

3 minutes ago, makapaka said:

One thing I would say - If the government and local authorities are gonna push this ideal then they need to put their money where their mouth is.

 

and it would cost billions to make it workable.

 

im not against it: but using crookes and Walkley as an example - we now have an “active neighbourhood” where they’ve basically shut roads to get people to not use their cars.

 

the result is loads of ugly temporary lights, concrete road blocks, planters with dead plants - strewn all over the area.

 

and every morning I join a queue of idling cars that wasn’t there before it started.

 

sh or get off the pot comes to mind.

My bold

Don't worry about it. No one has any interest in building what would be required for this 'ideal'..

That's the imaginary carrot 

The stick will be along in the not too distant future👍

 

The futures not bright.

The future is restrictions. 

[Guest makapaka]

9 hours ago, The_DADDY said:

My bold

Don't worry about it. No one has any interest in building what would be required for this 'ideal'..

That's the imaginary carrot 

The stick will be along in the not too distant future👍

 

The futures not bright.

The future is restrictions. 

I think that’s equally nonsensical.