The Yom Kippur War .

[Axe]

4 minutes ago, m williamson said:

The Omagh bombers were terrorists for the reason that a peace deal was being worked on at the time and they wanted the violence to continue.

I am a consistent believer in the difference between right and wrong. Unlike a one eyed bigot.

Well done for admitting they were terrorists.  Now admit the IRA was a terrorist organisation and Hamas are also a terrorist organisation who both are responsible for cowardly murdering innocent civilians. 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Axe said:

Well done for admitting they were terrorists.  Now admit the IRA was a terrorist organisation and Hamas are also a terrorist organisation who both are responsible for cowardly murdering innocent civilians. 

Lets hear your definition of a terrorist organisation ?                  I'm  presuming you will say it includes any organisation which kills civilians ?

Which would mean that the British and American and Israeli armed forces are terrorists.

 

Whilst everyone wastes every opportunity for peace,  there will always be war,  and each side will always see the other as terrorists.

 

[m williamson]

22 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

Because they realised the armed struggle had failed they fell back on the wording of the 1921 treaty which said Ireland could only be reunited by peaceful means.

Not really well informed on the subject are you? 

There was no mechanism in place to enable the reunification of Ireland. The Irish have learned not to trust any British government without removing all wiggle room. The GFA provided that mechanism. Additionally, the British government placed on record its agreement that it no longer had any ' selfish, strategic or economic reason ' for retaining Northern Ireland in the Union. Britain relinquished Westminster's final authority over Northern Ireland and accepted that the people who lived there will decide.

It also agreed to Border Polls with a deciding margin of 50%+1 and that if necessary the polls can be held at intervals until such time as one is successful. Given a combination of demographics, the Republic economy and commonsense there's only one way this is going to end.

 

I'd hardly call that failure, and neither did the British Army http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/6276416.stm

[Guest]

53 minutes ago, cuttsie said:

One grandmother was forced onto a motor bike sat in the middle of two brave freedom fighters then paraded around the Gaza Strip , a young German lass was stripped naked and also paraded around . Ask yourselves would the Israel soldiers be allowed to do this , The answer is the World would be outraged , the terrorist sympathizers on here would ignore it as they ignored terrorist outrages nearer home .

The bombing of Gaza is predictable, Hamas knew it would happen but what can Israel do just sit back and take it .?  
 

Horrible though that is,  things like that have been happening since the beginning of time and every nation is guilty of it including ours or are you daft enough to thinks that we are not like that.

 

3 hours ago, Axe said:

You need to grow up.  It is nothing to do with right wing or left wing views.  It is to do with common decency.  If you were civilised then you would be condemning the terrorists attacks on innocent civilians.  What do you think the Hamas terrorists can achieve by murdering hundreds of innocent civilians and taking hostages?  What motive can there be for the murders other than some kind of deluded revenge.  The terrorists cannot expect their sickening violence and murdering actions to shock Israel into surrendering. The Hamas terrorists have condemned many Palestinians as well as Jews to a violent death as a consequence of starting a war.

 

Lets hear your definition of a terrorist organisation ?                  I'm  presuming you will say it includes any organisation which kills civilians ?

Which would mean that the British and American and Israeli armed forces are terrorists.

 

Whilst everyone wastes every opportunity for peace,  there will always be war,  and each side will always see the other as terrorists.

[harvey19]

8 minutes ago, m williamson said:

Not really well informed on the subject are you? 

There was no mechanism in place to enable the reunification of Ireland. The Irish have learned not to trust any British government without removing all wiggle room. The GFA provided that mechanism. Additionally, the British government placed on record its agreement that it no longer had any ' selfish, strategic or economic reason ' for retaining Northern Ireland in the Union. Britain relinquished Westminster's final authority over Northern Ireland and accepted that the people who lived there will decide.

It also agreed to Border Polls with a deciding margin of 50%+1 and that if necessary the polls can be held at intervals until such time as one is successful. Given a combination of demographics, the Republic economy and commonsense there's only one way this is going to end.

 

I'd hardly call that failure, and neither did the British Army http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/6276416.stm

Thousands of deaths and mailings was it worth it.

You really need to study the reality of what happened to peoples lives instead of just posting forgetting about them.

The GFA agreement allowed terrorists who had committed horrific CRIMES to be released after just 2 years custody.

The agreement did not include crown forces presumably so that the divisions could continue.

I have recommended books to you which will give you the reality of the situation, maybe start with Tony Blair and theIRA . A factual non biased book.

You really need to read about the situation in depth rather than history from 100 years ago.

[cressida]

1 hour ago, cuttsie said:

One grandmother was forced onto a motor bike sat in the middle of two brave freedom fighters then paraded around the Gaza Strip , a young German lass was stripped naked and also paraded around . Ask yourselves would the Israel soldiers be allowed to do this , The answer is the World would be outraged , the terrorist sympathizers on here would ignore it as they ignored terrorist outrages nearer home .

The bombing of Gaza is predictable, Hamas knew it would happen but what can Israel do just sit back and take it .?  
 

There was a young woman shown on Sky News being kidnapped on a motorbike,  later shown drinking from a bottle of water - her poor father was distraught so must have been another woman who was the grandmother.

 

I believed both Israeli and America intelligence services to be first class ,  why wasn't this attack on their 'radar'?

[m williamson]

15 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

There were IRA campaigns in the 1950s and more recently.

If republicans had worked for the betterment of the 6 counties instead of not accepting the existence of them unification may have come sooner

There were 2 stumbling blocks, the planters had brought wealth and industry to the north and the strong hold of the Catholic Church in the south.

Terrorists are not romantic figures but criminals, they are people who commit horrific crimes and bring lifelong pain to relatives of their victims.

'If republicans had worked for the betterment of the six counties'.  How in hell were they supposed to do that when the Unionists had had a gerrymandered fiefdom handed to them and they set out to discriminate against the Catholic/nationalist community in every possible way?

Why do you think that a Civil Rights Movement developed in NI? A movement that was physically attacked by state forces and beaten off the streets.

 

The unionists had total control, it was up to them to exercise it in an even handed way. They could have set out to prove that the Free State as it was then had made a mistake and should have remained in the union. Instead, like the scorpion on the frogs back they couldn't help themselves.

 

When the political wish of a nation has been expressed in a democratic vote and it is denied by state force as happened in Ireland what exactly do you think people should have done about it?

[harvey19]

11 minutes ago, Organgrinder said:

Horrible though that is,  things like that have been happening since the beginning of time and every nation is guilty of it including ours or are you daft enough to thinks that we are not like that.

 

Lets hear your definition of a terrorist organisation ?                  I'm  presuming you will say it includes any organisation which kills civilians ?

Which would mean that the British and American and Israeli armed forces are terrorists.

 

Whilst everyone wastes every opportunity for peace,  there will always be war,  and each side will always see the other as terrorists.

A terrorist is a person that tries to change a political situation by non democratic means.

A terrorist will often create a situation where there is a repercussion and the terrorist will then exploit that repercussion.

Terrorists commit civil CRIMES whereas in a war the Geneva Convention deals with war crimes.

[harvey19]

2 minutes ago, m williamson said:

'If republicans had worked for the betterment of the six counties'.  How in hell were they supposed to do that when the Unionists had had a gerrymandered fiefdom handed to them and they set out to discriminate against the Catholic/nationalist community in every possible way?

Why do you think that a Civil Rights Movement developed in NI? A movement that was physically attacked by state forces and beaten off the streets.

 

The unionists had total control, it was up to them to exercise it in an even handed way. They could have set out to prove that the Free State as it was then had made a mistake and should have remained in the union. Instead, like the scorpion on the frogs back they couldn't help themselves.

 

When the political wish of a nation has been expressed in a democratic vote and it is denied by state force as happened in Ireland what exactly do you think people should have done about it?

Gerrymandering was wrong the civil rights march you refer to was at Burntolet Bridge.

Many areas were of mixed religion until the 1969 campaign. 

Using force against government forces was never going to create a peaceful union even if reunification was granted especially when numerous atrocities are committed against civilians, policemen and soldiers.

You seem to know a bit about the early history please explain why the island was split and what was the difference between Collins and DeValera.

[m williamson]

31 minutes ago, Axe said:

Well done for admitting they were terrorists.  Now admit the IRA was a terrorist organisation and Hamas are also a terrorist organisation who both are responsible for cowardly murdering innocent civilians. 

Cowardly murdering innocent civilians. 

Like the Glennane Gang consisting of 25 British soldiers and police officers who were responsible for murdering over 120 innocent civilians and the the British state forces that colluded and took part in the Dublin and Monaghan bombings killing 33 people and an unborn eight month old baby.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glenanne_gang

 

https://cain.ulster.ac.uk/victims/docs/newspapers/sunday_business_post/heatley_spb_040207.pdf

Those type of terrorists?

 

Tell us, when a country has democratically expressed its wish to be independent by vote and has had that wish denied by state force what is left for them to do about it?