The Yom Kippur War .

[harvey19]

2 minutes ago, Anna B said:

I believe that is being considered, and is known as the 'two state solution.'

But such is the animosity between the two, will it be adhered to? 

Treaties etc have been drawn up in the past and broken.

The new treaties/borders must be written into the constitution of the countries and importantly into the political parties legal status for being and continued existence.

If these are breached other countries should not recognise the political parties.

10 minutes ago, Anna B said:

It's an unofficial war that has been going on for years. Israel have taken Palestinian land, broken treaties and constantly bullied and harassed Palestine, cutting off their water and power etc.

There have been pot shot bombings, at least 10 violent skirmishes including two declared wars.

These then appear to be international crimes which the international law enforcing agencies should have dealt with.

 

[The_DADDY]

6 hours ago, cressida said:

Not I hope if you have an addictive personality

No lovey,  I haven't especially when it comes to gambling. Infact I haven't gambled since my early 20s 👍

[The_DADDY]

Anyone going to this?

 

 

@Mkapaka it's from Facebook so you'd better ignore it.👍

[Anna B]

25 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

The new treaties/borders must be written into the constitution of the countries and importantly into the political parties legal status for being and continued existence.

If these are breached other countries should not recognise the political parties.

These then appear to be international crimes which the international law enforcing agencies should have dealt with.

 

Yes, I agree, but the water is muddied by the fact that England and America and many of the West support Israel, ( because it gives them a foothold in the oil fields, and access to nuclear weapons?)

And Russia and most of the volatile middle East supports Palestine, (simplified version.)

 

Would you want to risk a proxy WW lll by leaving it in the hands of known fanatics on both sides, who have broken treaties in the past? 

 

I believe (but I'm not sure) that drawing up official defined borders etc would make any incursion an official war crime rather than a 'conflict' and if either side deviates it will be a duty for other countries to join in /support / intervene. (think of Poland.) And it would probably become a holy war too. 

(Margaret Thatcher was very careful to always define the invasion of the Falklands as a 'conflict' rather than a war for this very reason I believe.  It makes a difference)

 

It's complicated, and I really don't know, it's beyond my pay grade. That's why we have to leave it up to the diplomats, the arbitrators, negotiators and (God help us) the Lawyers and Politicians...

Edited October 29, 2023 by Anna B

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Anna B said:

Yes, I agree, but the water is muddied by the fact that England and America and many of the West support Israel, ( because it gives them a foothold in the oil fields, and access to nuclear weapons?)

And Russia and most of the volatile middle East supports Palestine, (simplified version.)

 

Would you want to risk a proxy WW lll by leaving it in the hands of known fanatics on both sides, who have broken treaties in the past? 

 

I believe (but I'm not sure) that drawing up official defined borders etc would make any incursion an official war crime rather than a 'conflict' and if either side deviates it will be a duty for other countries to join in /support / intervene. (think of Poland.) And it would probably become a holy war too. 

(Margaret Thatcher was very careful to always define the invasion of the Falklands as a 'conflict' rather than a war for this very reason I believe.  It makes a difference)

 

It's complicated, and I really don't know, it's beyond my pay grade. That's why we leave it up to the diplomats, the arbitrators, negotiators and (God help us) the Politicians...

That's very well explained Anna and shows how difficult the situation is.

Glad I don't have the job of raising enough good will and sorting it.

 

[harvey19]

8 minutes ago, Anna B said:

Yes, I agree, but the water is muddied by the fact that England and America and many of the West support Israel, ( because it gives them a foothold in the oil fields, and access to nuclear weapons?)

And Russia and most of the volatile middle East supports Palestine, (simplified version.)

 

Would you want to risk a proxy WW lll by leaving it in the hands of known fanatics on both sides, who have broken treaties in the past? 

 

I believe (but I'm not sure) that drawing up official defined borders etc would make any incursion an official war crime rather than a 'conflict' and if either side deviates it will be a duty for other countries to join in /support / intervene. (think of Poland.) And it would probably become a holy war too. 

(Margaret Thatcher was very careful to always define the invasion of the Falklands as a 'conflict' rather than a war for this very reason I believe.  It makes a difference)

 

It's complicated, and I really don't know, it's beyond my pay grade. That's why we have to leave it up to the diplomats, the arbitrators, negotiators and (God help us) the Lawyers and Politicians...

We could just say "Vested Interests"

We only know a tiny bit of what is happening at high levels of government at home and internationally.

An interesting point of debate is whether the 7th October attack was to get the reaction that has happened to garner support and bring other countries in to support the Palestinians.

 

[Guest]

38 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

I find it hard to understand hoe Hamas terrorists can be separated from the ruling party of Hamas.

Is the separation a justification for not declaring a legal state of war between the 2 countries.

I fully appreciate the majority of citizens in both countries want to live a peaceful life and do not support war.

Terrorist organisations often have a fighting wing and a political wing as you can see with the IRA and Sein Fein.

The present situation in Northern Ireland ( though I don't really want to raise that subject ) shows that there is always an opening for a political settlement if minds will meet.

What is sure,  is that bloodshed alone has never solved any  situation like this throughout history and,  though you can kill terrorists,  you cannot kill a terrorist organisation by force of arms.

Meaning that Netanyahu has failed even before his invasion.

 

[harvey19]

1 minute ago, Organgrinder said:

Terrorist organisations often have a fighting wing and a political wing as you can see with the IRA and Sein Fein.

The present situation in Northern Ireland ( though I don't really want to raise that subject ) shows that there is always an opening for a political settlement if minds will meet.

What is sure,  is that bloodshed alone has never solved any  situation like this throughout history and,  though you can kill terrorists,  you cannot kill a terrorist organisation by force of arms.

Meaning that Netanyahu has failed even before his invasion.

 

Sinn Fein always denied being the same as the IRA this is the difference.

Strangely we as a country get on very well with our past world war enemies of Germany and Japan.

Where there is a will there is a way.

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, harvey19 said:

Sinn Fein always denied being the same as the IRA this is the difference.

Strangely we as a country get on very well with our past world war enemies of Germany and Japan.

Where there is a will there is a way.

Don't know where you get that from.  To the best of my knowledge,  it's always been openly acknowledged that Sein Fein were the political wing of the IRA.

Maybe the denials are more in line with those in the political wing,   denying taking part in the acts of violence  that the fighting side would have pursued.

The Irish situation is still very fragile but at least an indicator that getting around a table is worth a try.

 

[trastrick]

21 hours ago, mafya said:

Israel is a terrorist state inflicting terror and occupation on innocent Palestinians. Fledgling democracy my arse…

Yep. Got it!

 

I understand there's a couple of wars going on about it! 

 

20 hours ago, Prettytom said:

You can see Israel behaving more and more as a rogue state. Killing kids, targeting the sick, indiscriminate air strikes.

 

These are war crimes, make no mistake. 

That's your wars for you!

 

Remember Dresden? Hiroshima? Nagasaki?