Oaps Under Surveillance

[Beamish]

Personally I find it offensive that the State Pension is called a 'Benefit'.

It is our money that we were forced to pay into a corrupt scheme.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Beamish said:

Personally I find it offensive that the State Pension is called a 'Benefit'.

It is our money that we were forced to pay into a corrupt scheme.

That's true.

In fact,  all the money they have is what we were forced to pay to them in the first place but when they share it out,  they always get the biggest share.

 

[Jim Hardie]

3 hours ago, Mkapaka said:

Yeah sounds a great idea - why would you give money to some well off pensioner who can live comfortably without it?

 

 

Who decides what ‘well off’ is? Be careful what you wish for.

[Annie Bynnol]

51 minutes ago, Beamish said:

Personally I find it offensive that the State Pension is called a 'Benefit'.

It is our money that we were forced to pay into a corrupt scheme.

   The 'benefits' of a scheme that your are entitlements to during/after your time as a contributor. Such 'benevolent' schemes have existed for hundreds of years.

   Pensions and unemployment benefit for working people were paid for by employer and the employee National Insurance contributions and these benefits not means tested. People who could not support  themselves relied on Welfare later Social Security payments and were means tested. These were not 'benefits' of a scheme.

   Over time the two areas have overlapped and the word 'benefit' applied to both. The biggest difference nowadays being that the State Pension benefit is taxable income so it is, in a sense, reduced the more you get from other taxable pensions and income.

    How many £billions pa would is cost to run a Government 'means testing' system when most of the cost nowadays is down to the pension provider.

 

 

[Anna B]

4 hours ago, Mkapaka said:

Yeah sounds a great idea - why would you give money to some well off pensioner who can live comfortably without it?

 

 

Because he's paid taxes all his working life and probably got very little for it up to now? 

And because a works pension is not enough to live on in most cases. You need both.

A state pension is not and never has been a 'benefit.' therefore it should not be means tested.

 

This government seems to think that the current pension of £700 a month is enough to live on.

Do you really trust them to set the bar as to who is 'well off.'

As someone else has said, be careful what you wish for.  

Edited December 13, 2023 by Anna B

[Al Bundy]

40 minutes ago, Anna B said:

Because he's paid taxes all his working life and probably got very little for it up to now? 

And because a works pension is not enough to live on in most cases. You need both.

A state pension is not and never has been a 'benefit.' therefore it should not be means tested.

 

This government seems to think that the current pension of £700 a month is enough to live on.

Do you really trust them to set the bar as to who is 'well off.'

As someone else has said, be careful what you wish for.  

Isn't the full state pension 203 pounds per week?

[ECCOnoob]

1 hour ago, Anna B said:

Because he's paid taxes all his working life and probably got very little for it up to now? 

And because a works pension is not enough to live on in most cases. You need both.

A state pension is not and never has been a 'benefit.' therefore it should not be means tested.

 

This government seems to think that the current pension of £700 a month is enough to live on.

Do you really trust them to set the bar as to who is 'well off.'

As someone else has said, be careful what you wish for.  

Are you deliberately forgetting things like free prescriptions, free eye tests, free bus passes, winter fuel allowances, cold weather payments, potential eligibility for housing benefit, potential eligibility for council tax discount, various discounts from private businesses, tax credits for looking after grandchildren, discounted train travel.....

 

Also, the government doesn't expect people to simply "live on that".  They are smart enough to understand that a big majority of pensioners own assets, including their own home, savings, investment, trusts and other sorts of funds which any sensible person will invest and plan to prepare for their old age.  

 

Stats show that at the end of 2020, 80% of people 65 and over were owning their own home.  Out of that, around 75% were mortgage free.

 

The taxpayers alliance calculates an average employee pays around £70k NI contributions over a working lifetime.  

 

At your so-called pitiful £700 a month rate that will mean one person taking their state pension at 66 and living to the average life expectancy of 80 would receive £117,000. 

 

That's about 67% more out of the pot than their contributor into it.

 

It's damn right state pension should be means tested. Something's got to give. Come back to the real world. The state doesn't fund a lifestyle and, irrelevant of the woe is me 'poverty' tales - there are lots of people taking out far more than they ever pay in to the system.  

Edited December 13, 2023 by ECCOnoob

[Mkapaka]

4 hours ago, Anna B said:

Because he's paid taxes all his working life and probably got very little for it up to now? 

And because a works pension is not enough to live on in most cases. You need both.

A state pension is not and never has been a 'benefit.' therefore it should not be means tested.

 

This government seems to think that the current pension of £700 a month is enough to live on.

Do you really trust them to set the bar as to who is 'well off.'

As someone else has said, be careful what you wish for.  

That’s a different argument - the government would need to be held to account.

 

the simple fact is that people who were really in need of a pension could receive more help if those that weren’t in need didn’t get one.

[Jim Hardie]

European countries with higher monthly state pensions.

Not sure why Germany is not on the list but I’m sure it’s bigger than ours.

 

https://www.almondfinancial.co.uk/pension-breakeven-index-how-does-the-uk-state-pension-compare-to-the-rest-of-europe/

 

 

Luxembourg £3,050.57

Belgium £2,709.93

Spain £2,287.24

Switzerland £2,123.54

Liechtenstein £2,061.02

Denmark £1,647.56

Norway £1,579.78

Iceland £1,524.20

France £1497.73

Cyprus £1,485.81

Netherlands £1,102.34

Bosnia and Herzegovina £979.72

Ireland £962.08

United Kingdom £802.32

Edited December 13, 2023 by Jim Hardie

[Al Bundy]

8 minutes ago, Jim Hardie said:

European countries with higher monthly state pensions.

Not sure why Germany is not on the list but I’m sure it’s bigger than ours.

 

https://www.almondfinancial.co.uk/pension-breakeven-index-how-does-the-uk-state-pension-compare-to-the-rest-of-europe/

 

 

Luxembourg £3,050.57

Belgium £2,709.93

Spain £2,287.24

Switzerland £2,123.54

Liechtenstein £2,061.02

Denmark £1,647.56

Norway £1,579.78

Iceland £1,524.20

France £1497.73

Cyprus £1,485.81

Netherlands £1,102.34

Bosnia and Herzegovina £979.72

Ireland £962.08

United Kingdom £802.32

Have you researched the cost of living in those higher than the UK?