Sheffield Homelessness At All-Time High

[AndrewC]

1 minute ago, redruby said:

I agree with most of your points but there’s that phrase about ‘blaming’ immigrants again.  It’s quite possible to have genuine concerns about rapid population increase without ‘blaming’ immigrants.  It’s not about ‘blaming’ them it’s about concern over immigration policy which is not the same thing.  Of course if the population increases 15% in 20 years and is rising it will affect housing!!  Pretending otherwise doesn’t make it not so.  Of course there are other factors but you shouldn’t ignore ones you don’t want to hear about.

Here's the problem; mentioning population increase & immigration as a factor, amongst others, and giving them their fair weighting as factors in the grand scheme of things is fine.

 

However; persistently focussing on those issues, claiming they have more importance than they do, and overlooking & downplaying other, more influential factors is when it starts to look suspicious.

 

Too many people on this thread can be easily accused of the latter. It needs addressing.

[Anna B]

37 minutes ago, redruby said:

I agree with most of your points but there’s that phrase about ‘blaming’ immigrants again.  It’s quite possible to have genuine concerns about rapid population increase without ‘blaming’ immigrants.  It’s not about ‘blaming’ them it’s about concern over immigration policy which is not the same thing.  Of course if the population increases 15% in 20 years and is rising it will affect housing!!  Pretending otherwise doesn’t make it not so.  Of course there are other factors but you shouldn’t ignore ones you don’t want to hear about.

Sorry, I wasn't blaming immigrants. Exactly the opposite actually, which is what I meant by saying they were a 'red herring' in other words simply a misleading , wrong assumption, distracting people from the real cause. 

 

Meanwhile...

Instead of property developers (often from London) or Private Landlords,  IMO rather than building more houses, local Councills should be buying up these vacant dwellings, refurbing them to a reasonable standard, (costing about £30,000) and adding them to their housing stock, to rent out to locals at affordable prices. Quicker and cheaper than building new houses.

[redruby]

2 hours ago, AndrewC said:

Here's the problem; mentioning population increase & immigration as a factor, amongst others, and giving them their fair weighting as factors in the grand scheme of things is fine.

 

However; persistently focussing on those issues, claiming they have more importance than they do, and overlooking & downplaying other, more influential factors is when it starts to look suspicious.

 

Too many people on this thread can be easily accused of the latter. It needs addressing.

The trouble is though  we tend to go to extremes:  either ‘its all the fault of immigrants’ or a complete failure to acknowledge that is a factor at all and/or jumping on everyone who even mentions it and assuming they are a horrible, racist bigot.  It is so frustrating that it’s so difficult to have a sensible, grown up conversation about this.  Trying to squash  people for bringing this up and trying to shut down discussion is counterproductive IMO.

[Anna B]

What is most upsetting is that there are still people in general and on Sheffield Forum who don't believe this crisis is happening at all. They just moan about the number of vagrants in the city centre as if they're there just to annoy them. 

 

They're also very quick to blame them for being homeless - it's all their own fault, (it isn't) or they're all drug addicts (they're not) or feckless, idle indolents who won't work (they're not.)

I hate to tell them but anyone can become homeless very quickly should circumstances so conspire, and when you're down and out it can be very hard to claw your way back. Have a little compassion.  

[mafya]

I blame the likes of Sarah beeny with her program about buying houses to fix up and sell on or rent out in the early 2000 onwards years plus the free movement from Europe and other immigration coupled with the shortage of properties that has lead to where we are now.

It didn’t help that about 30-40 thousand properties were knocked down and not replaced by Sheffield council and we don’t know how many were knocked down by other councils although I understand the councils reasons were that they had loads of empty properties.

I also think UK property should not be allowed to be bought by foreign investors as that also causes a disadvantage.

Immigration is to blame for the rise in population but we shouldn’t blame the immigrants we should blame the Govt who should check we have enough housing stock to cope with the additional numbers of immigrants.

 

[mafya]

10 hours ago, redruby said:

The trouble is though  we tend to go to extremes:  either ‘its all the fault of immigrants’ or a complete failure to acknowledge that is a factor at all and/or jumping on everyone who even mentions it and assuming they are a horrible, racist bigot.  It is so frustrating that it’s so difficult to have a sensible, grown up conversation about this.  Trying to squash  people for bringing this up and trying to shut down discussion is counterproductive IMO.

It’s the fault of immigration numbers coming in and not the fault of immigrants themselves so  the above is to blame because the govt actually makes plenty of money through visa applications etc hence why they are not controlling it.

[redruby]

3 hours ago, mafya said:

It’s the fault of immigration numbers coming in and not the fault of immigrants themselves so  the above is to blame because the govt actually makes plenty of money through visa applications etc hence why they are not controlling it.

Yes, and I’ve said that many times but still the replies keep coming about it being wrong to ‘blame’ immigrants. Others may possibly have done this but I certainly have not.  

[redruby]

11 hours ago, Anna B said:

What is most upsetting is that there are still people in general and on Sheffield Forum who don't believe this crisis is happening at all. They just moan about the number of vagrants in the city centre as if they're there just to annoy them. 

 

They're also very quick to blame them for being homeless - it's all their own fault, (it isn't) or they're all drug addicts (they're not) or feckless, idle indolents who won't work (they're not.)

I hate to tell them but anyone can become homeless very quickly should circumstances so conspire, and when you're down and out it can be very hard to claw your way back. Have a little compassion.  

I’ve often said I’d be prepared to pay, within reason, more tax to give people the proper support they need to get off the streets.

I can believe not all of the street people in the city centre are drug addicts.  But realistically, and sadly, I strongly suspect most are.  Not through choice or being lazy though.  The issues they are dealing with are complex and need proper support.  This is why people wanting to help should give to homeless charities and not enable addiction giving money to beggars.

[spilldig]

19 hours ago, redruby said:

I agree with most of your points but there’s that phrase about ‘blaming’ immigrants again.  It’s quite possible to have genuine concerns about rapid population increase without ‘blaming’ immigrants.  It’s not about ‘blaming’ them it’s about concern over immigration policy which is not the same thing.  Of course if the population increases 15% in 20 years and is rising it will affect housing!!  Pretending otherwise doesn’t make it not so.  Of course there are other factors but you shouldn’t ignore ones you don’t want to hear about.

Surely being the city of sanctuary must have made a big difference.